[Caroline and Dave]

Following on from Boreas excellent post on another thread it got me to thinking how many ex pats have made good friends with Kiwis or are most of your friends Ex Pats? Back in the UK we have two sets of good friends who are Kiwis.We are very friendly people and hope to fit in but this just got me wondering http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=9635&page=2

Kindest regards

Dave and Caroline

[sizzlingbadger]

Probably different to most on here as our whole group of friends are kiwis :D We know a few expats that we're in contact with and see infrequently.

Oh and of course all you guys on here we're in contact with :D

[Diny]

From my own experience, I find (in general) NZers to be friendly enough but like Borea said, I find it to be largely superficial.

There's never any shortage of people to chat to in the shops and on the street but the friendship (in so many cases) seems to fall short of being actually invited into the fold.

However, maybe to offer an explanantion for this - we're in our mid 40s and have found those of the same age have usually found their own 'click' (meant in the necest possible way) of mates - usually lifelong - they share alot of history and have become very close. This being the case, it can be very difficult to 'break into' that click. Hard enough as a couple - you should try doing it as a single person (which I am 85% of the time).

Diny

[jubjub]

Most of the friends I have here are kiwis, mainly cos I met them at coffee groups with our new babies. I also have a few UK friends, and even use a UK hairdresser!

A pretty good mix really.

[Trigirl]

i guess its a bit early for me to say. we've been here a bit under 3 months but we arrived here as welly shut for xmas so didn't really meet anyone at all for a month!

i think you are likely to make friends with people who are in similar situations to you or where you have common interests. for some that will be other expats - after all we've all been through a similar experience! for others it will be though hobbies or whatever.

at the moment i'm really making the effort to meet people who share my main interests. i've been along to the local photography club, have been running the 5ks on the waterfront and will join that running club when it starts up again in a few weeks, and tomorrow will be going along to the local badminton club. so hopefully in a few months i'll know lots more kiwis!

[sarahw]

I second what Diny says it is a lot harder to break in and make close friends... I attend plenty of baby coffee groups but do feel its all a bit superficial. I do spend a lot of time alone during the day & its great to have someone to chat to on the phone or meet for coffee, but only have 1 person who I can just 'let it all out' to like an old old friend. I'm lucky in the fact that OH's sister lives in Melbourne - we moved to our respective new countries at the same time so we can sound off to each other on similar timezones - we were good friends before we moved & its great to catch up & hear things from her perspective too.

I'm also lucky that I worked before we had the baby so I made some good friends doing that & I have a mix of friends in NZ - closest friends being 2 Americans, 1 Pom, 1 German & 3 Kiwis (funny how we live in quite an area for Brits but only 1 good British friend & 1 other couple we see socially that are Brits - the rest of our social circle are mainly Kiwi).

I think I was expecting too much after all it took me 30 odd years to build up the friends at home, so why should I expect to click and make friends immediately over here? It took time, and a lot of effort, but it did seem a lot easier in the UK to make good friends.

Kiwi neighbours have been more like family than neighbours or friends (they are my daughters Nanny & Poppy over here!) Often dragging me & child in for coffee & cakes, getting each other's mail when we're on holiday and being there if you run out of a key ingredient, or including us in family celebrations including Xmas Day on our first year when we were all alone.

OH has made some great friends (Kiwis), although again he admits not as close as his UK friends, but even so there is a couple that either of us could call on no matter what time of day or night. He met the hubby on his first week of work. They too have been wonderful, giving us all their daughter's baby clothes and lending us baby toys.

I know we're all comparing making friends over here as opposed to making friends in in the country you came from, but I'm sure that anyone moving from a different country to the UK, or US, say would have similar experiences in making friends as us moving to NZ?

[nippa&pippa]

We have both kiwis and ex-pat (british, swedish and canadian so far!) friends. Kiwis are very friendly but hard to break into their groups at playgroups, kindy etc, so like jub jub, you have to wait till they come to you, finally last monday they did...I am getting there, having children help to break a ice. My husband mentioned that lots of his workmates is kiwis and he also find very hard to break in unless you go with flow with them, even they take micky at him about 'pom' etc. Other british who had worked there are usually mouthy or easy to lose temper, so they been testing my husband :o Lucky he was laid back and easy going with kiwis, and won them over :clap Now they like to help him out with any information about areas, what is on etc whatever he ask them. Also one of them rang us just before new year eve, invitied us over for new year eve party with all kiwis!!! We did go and it was haliarious experiences!

[Avalon]

Im finding that im now making freinds in the oddest of places. Last week teh girl in the printers (im getting some brochures done) asked if I wanted to grab coffee sometime, as we were chatting for ages. And the staff in the coffee shop in carterton are almost friends now :nice1

On the whole though - most friends we have made are from hubbys work, and automatically tend to be expats. And i have a fantastic group of "coffee dates" from here of course :D

At the end of the day - only a few people we have got to know are born and bred kiwis, but thats just the way the cookie crumbles. I cant say its because they are superficial or otherwise - its just that to be honest - in our lives - we come accross more ex-pats than not. Our neighbours are not "overly friendly", but I wonder how much of that is because you dont live somewhere like this if you like being in each other pockets anyway.

I cant even say that there is a difference in the friendliness between our expat friends and kiwi friends - but then I only ever really think of them as "friends" anyway.

Hxxx

[Kim39]

Am afraid that most of our friends are expats. As much as i am involved with the local footie scene here in TA, we as a family don't tend to socialise with the players and families. Don't get me wrong i do enjoy their company when we have any footie do's, but overall we seem to have stuck to who/what we know best. Work colleagues are just that to me, whereas E has quite a good relationship with her co workers, and has quite recently been socialising with them,and once again is out for a few hours after work with them tonight as one of the girls is leaving to do a 2yr stint in London.
Must do my best to try and integrate with the kiwi folk, but it just seems everytime we meet someone they turn out to be brits:laugh

Kim

[marcia]

We have a good mix of people, Diny obviously who is a 'pom' through and through, but lots of Kiwis we have met from the stockcars, and also a few 'closet poms' who have been here since been kids and don't remember any different.

It is really hard when nobody knows your history and you can't do the 'do you remember stories, (but hey I'd like to forget a few of those stories anyway!!!!! :laugh )

All you can do is be honest and open with everyone, accept all invitations, don't judge people on first appearences (I have done this in the past and found myself to be totally wrong!!) and remember to issues invitations yourself!


Think how many years it does take to build up friendships, it isn't going to happen overnight, like a good wine it needs time to mature!! :nice1

[Super_BQ]

I've been in NZ for a long time and believe it's more to do with the culture. On average, Kiwis moves house every 5 years which can't help at all to making close friends. From your kids that meet friends at school to losing important business or social contacts in the neighborhood. There's no sense of the "neighborhood friendiness" that is often found in America (weekly BBQ parties, neighborhood watch etc.)

One look on American TV and movies that show how 1 neighbor waves "hi" to their neighbor up the street while watering or cutting their front lawn. Naturally not a thing you see in most parts of NZ as most homes put up high fences and blocking trees in the front of their houses.

I grew up in a small town in Canada and my father had always wanted to move down to the big city Vancouver (BC). 30 years later, he still owns the house ; and likewise with almost everyone up & down the street. I came to the conclusion that though it may be easy to just sell the house (for a big profit?) and move; I knew that $ can never choose the fate of how good or bad the new neighbors will be. I've moved 3 places in Christchurch within 10 years and on each instance, it was quite rare to get a chance to really talk to the neighbors (too many high fences).

Perhaps being asian has something to do with it? Not at all. As a member of the local NZ Chinese Association, i've found the local chinese people of NZ themselves have an immense clicky attitude. Majority of them being quite wealthy owning vast amounts of real estate and their luxery BMW/Audis etc.
For many years I use to play in their regional 'touch rugby' competition (events held in a different city for each year). For most of the time I knew the top players were quite arrogant. From being highly competitive on the field to social events in town - they maintained their high level of clickyness. It wasn't until 2 unjust things that happened where I decided to no longer be involved with these peeps. I won't go into the detail but if this were to happen back in Canada, they would be in for a big beating! :yes

My father back during the 60s told me about how clickly the local NZ chinese people were. One clan would say how poor and unskilled the others were because they were market produce farmers and how highly skilled their sons/daughters were as they became lawyers and doctors. Nowadays I see the very same attitude my father had seen some 40+ years ago.... some things just don't change.

BQ

[stu70]

BQ, an excellent read, Thanks. Some things in this world never change I guess. Need to feel superior to fellow humans is probably more universal and prevalent than we would like to believe. What is ironic is that our time on this planet is so short(in grand scheme of things) that even small doses of this attitude are totally unwarranted. Regards,

[Cindy]

Super BQ, I went through the same and it's even amongst my own family members. Therefore, I no longer communicate with them as much. There is doctors, lawyers and successful business men that make some feel superior enough to point fingers and belittle. I decided not to participate in any family or other activities. There is too many sentences that start with so and so is making more money than so and so or so and so's daughter or son is going to Harvard/Standford and where are your kids going? Or so and so just bought another house in Spain, they are sooo rich. Ugh! I'm asian and married to a non-asian and that makes me somewhat an outcast and wouldn't want to subject my husband to any of the above anyways. I don't think it's ever going to change.

[flatshoes]

I have moved a number of times in my life (at this point, too many - I am ready to simply move someplace sane and croak there, LOL). I found that (as many have said here) making friends through children (playgroups and whatnot) is one good way but also joining a volunteer group and sticking with it awhile might help too. Find a cause that you feel strongly about (environmentalism or eldercare or literacy or RSPCA or something, but a "civic-minded" activity) and just do that for awhile without any expectations, enjoying it for its own sake, and often socialization will spring out of that. I also found that trading food with neighbours is something done here as well as "at home" and I liked that, familiar and nice custom. Next time you bake some biscuits, trot some over to a neighbour for no reason at all and don't expect anything back. Traditions like that have a way of perpetuating themselves. :D

[constablechuck]

In my line of work I see the both the best and worst of Kiwi culture, in general I would have to say that the Kiwi's are an open and friendly bunch that are more accepting of strangers and immigrants, they seem to have a curious nature and a good sense of humor, I lived in several states in the U.S. but it is a huge country and the culture can be very different from one place to another so I'll just say that in my experience people in the U.S. are in general less friendly and accepting of strangers.

I seem to connect better with the Kiwis than with the few expat Americans I've met in NZ, it could just be that Americans don't travel across the world to socialise with other Americans.

One thing that drives me a bit nuts at times is the overly trusting nature of the Kiwi culture, the Kiwis I know often can't understand why I get suspicious of people, I often tell them they would be easy victims in the U.S.

One thing that some Kiwi's have said that bothers them about the 30 and 40 something expats is that they come over with a boat load of NZ$ after exchanging the U.S. Dollar or even more so the mighty British Pound, buy homes and cars for cash, have no mortgage and still complain about the low NZ wages, all the while the 30 and 40 something Kiwis survive on the same low wages while paying a heftly mortgage and car payment.