[AlexUK]

Hey,

I see alot of people explaining on here why NZ is right for them, and i see alot of people saying thats its a "better quality of life" or "better standing of living" etc so i was wondering if you could explain what makes it a better quality of life, even when your money doesnt go as far?

[swissmissdesigner]

I am wondering too.
Even though I love NZ and I want to move there, I couldn't make the big move because of the low salaries and high expenses.
I am wondering how long I can be happy enjoying the beauty of a country without having enough money to be able to pay my bills?

[AlexUK]

It wasnt really the money part that bothered me, i just wanted to know why people think it makes it so great even with the money thing.

What is a "better quality of life"

[Myrkk]

We're not there yet and haven't ever been. However, the attraction for us is less people, i.e. 4.1 million as opposed to over 60million people in a country roughly the same size.
Also the slower pace of life and yes even the fact the NZ is described as being approx. 15yrs behind the UK.
We're not hiding our heads in the sand and do realise that NZ will have social and economic problems in the same way as the UK does but if we can have a less frenetic pace of life out there then that will be worth it.
Also a better work/life balance. My hubbie was doing a 3-4 hr round commute a day and now is working away from home 3 days a week. This has been the story of our 13yrs together and tbh we're both fed up with it and the resultant house moves. NZ will hopefully get us away from this.

[Carol]

Personally for me - it is the lack of the
"must have it now at any cost"
consumeristic way of life that I had got used to in the UK - and I have to say I still see whenever I visit.

You can live a very simple life here - and yet be happier.
It's hard to contemplate before you get here - and if you enjoy the consumerism - it definitely WONT be a better quality of life for you.
Unfortunately for me - this is counterbalanced by the lack of family here. Which to me has a negative effect on my quality of life.
(I appreciate this wont affect everyone).
Because of my own upbringing - I feel like I have a huge void in my life here.

But the big plus for us is our relationships with our kids.
We do things with them (even now at 18 and 15) that we never would have done in the UK

And they are what it is all about really........

[wilson182]

I always think of it as a case of - be carefull what you wish for, cause it may come true. :yes

For example

You want to leave your home country to be out of debt? - Great, so did we. But, technically - if you had enough money in your home country surely you wouldn't have been in debt there (very simplistic, I know). Believe it or not getting out of debt is the easy part, STAYING out of debt is difficult. I had to learn that there are things you can't have, or that you have to save up for, rather than reaching for the credit card.

You want to move to a country with not so many people? - Cool, but that also means not much competion, and there for not so much choice in the supermarket. Hardly any unemployment means that quite a few employers think they can take advantage of you. It means that things that were reasonably cheap in your home country may cost more here.

Having a good standard of living is different for every single person that posts on this forum. It depends on many factors, and you never really know whether its right for you until you do it. And if you decide its not? Well, hats off to you for trying :clap

Debs

[AlexUK]

Ok,

The things you just said are fairly good for me since i want to run my own business :D

I have no problems with debt, i dont spend much money, im good at saving.

[Nick88]

I came here to run my own business. We needed land and infrastructure that I knew we couldn't afford in the UK. We did buy here a few years ago when it was alot cheaper, but it would still be cheaper to do it here now.

You just need to research the market here carefully. See what the competition is like, pricing and volume, and location. All fairly basic stuff that just takes time to find out. What do you do?

[AlexUK]

I am a business student, ive wanted to run my own business for a while however it wouldnt be anything specific just a general business e.g. fast food place or a shop

It will be a year or two after i finish university until i can afford to run a business though.

[barryp]

Hardly any unemployment means that quite a few employers think they can take advantage of you.

That doesn't make any sense to me. Initutively, if there's a scarcity of labour, there's less ability for employers to take advantage because workers are free to go elsewhere if not given a fair shake. What do you mean?

Having a smaller labour market DOES pose problems for people with specialised skills, as the total number of jobs may be very small or the opportunity to create and grow a business may be constrained by lack of specialised skills in the workforce.

My basic definition of quality of life is pretty simple: I'm free to do what I please, without fear for my physical safety, and without having to think constantly about having enough money to live decently. Another aspect of QoL that I consider important is to be as free of ugliness as possible in regular daily life. Having to commute long distances on crowded or dirty trains (or on any freeway) is the type of ugliness I wish never to engage again. Graffiti, petty vandalism, car robberies, graffiti, etc. do not threaten me economically or physically, but destroy what remains of my soul. Finally, I'm passionate about the arts, and QoL for me implies living in a community where the arts are valued and I can, uh, expose myself to art.... http://www.photographicimage.com/merchant.ihtml?pid=620&step=4

Yes, this is subjective - it's possible for people reading this to share none of my QoL criteria, and I none of theirs. Usually when I hear the term 'QoL' here I think: "enjoy life with less stress and more energy for family and your particular passions."

[marcia]

For us quality of life is - seeing Kev much more than we did in the Uk - the kids love it having their dad home at 4.15 every day, and all weekend (me I reserve judgement :laugh ) In the uk kev would be up and off at 5.30 am and sometimes not back till 10 at night, and often had to work saturday mornings too.

Another thing we love, and the kids do too, is less pressure in schools, no SATS like in the uk, more sport for them in school.

I'm not bothered about the lack of choice in the supermarkets - in fact i think its quite good -but hey perhaps i just like the simple things in life! The lack of population is a big bonus, i hated driving in theuk and don't mind it half as much now, i don't end up coming home with sore shoulders from gripping the wheel and getting wound up with sitting in traffic jams, or crawling along at a snails pace, yeah there are some idiots on the road here- but you will get that anywhere you go.

My kids aren't bothered about having all the latest gadgets and games anymore, its just not important cos they love to be outside.

For us the climate (outside the houses at least!) is better I've done the Winter only having my coat on a couple of times, this winter has definately been easier to bear than the uk ones!

So its a mix of a lot of things for us that make it a better lifestyle, but i have to agree with Carol that the hardest part is not having family around, i often find myself just thinking of them and a little tear runs down my cheek when i think how long it is since I saw them last - but hey only 20 weeks and 1 day till my big sis comes to see us (not that I'm counting or anything!!!!!!! :raebanana )

[AlexUK]

So "better quality of life" is subjective, personally i dont have the family problem, i need to move out sometime, where better than new zealand :D

Thanks for the feedback :raebanana

[wilson182]

That doesn't make any sense to me. Initutively, if there's a scarcity of labour, there's less ability for employers to take advantage because workers are free to go elsewhere if not given a fair shake. What do you mean?



:o You are right, I have reread it and it doesn't make sence. I was typing faster than I was thinking.

[nippa&pippa]

No more rat race, long hour, long traffic jam and no more stress on my OH, mean my OH is relax and happier, able to spend more time with children. We live in rural locations, freedom for our children wondering off playing in the fields around us while my OH did fencing..something we won't get in UK...

[Familyofmonkeys]

No more rat race, long hour, long traffic jam and no more stress on my OH, mean my OH is relax and happier, able to spend more time with children. We live in rural locations, freedom for our children wondering off playing in the fields around us while my OH did fencing..something we won't get in UK...

We are also planning on living in rural area eventually.....children have the kind of freedom I had when growing up. I wouldn't dream of letting them out of my sight in the UK....with a higher population, there were more unsavory people around and it just didn't feel safe.

Other examples of improved quality of life for our family, apart from less time spent commuting: Sunday afternoon...fancy popping out for couple of hours with kids. In UK, that meant choice of:

1. One of the local towns (for visit to coffee shop or park) and spending alot of money on parking, plus even on Sunday, having to drive round until we find suitable parking space where we can get out of car easily...i.e. 3 kids in carseats!
2. Local stately home/country park grounds/place of interest....expensive car parking/entrance fees etc. Dirty toilets for changing nappies.
3. Go for walk round same roads of houses..again...and again. Can't take double buggy down more public footpaths, and even those you can walk down are covered with litter.
4. Go to local playground....risk disappointing kids if it is still covered from broken glass/cigarette butts from last nights louts.
5. Can't go swimming pool as you can't take more than one child per adult when they are under 5 in most pools.

Choices in NZ for Sunday afternoon:

1. Take kids out to coffee shop. Very cheap or free and accessible parking easy to find...even in Auckland. Very cheap to eat out in NZ, even when you consider lower wages.
2. Local place of interest/park grounds....free car parking. Often free entrance fees too. Clean toilets for changing nappies.
3. Go for walk...beautiful views everywhere that can be accessed even with pushchairs. People seem to use litter bins too.
4. Go to local playground...clean and well kept!
5. Go to beach (never more than 1/2 hour away from practically empty beach) to take it in turns having a paddle. It's free to park...free to access, you can take a picnic, and even if you eat it in the car, you don't have to watch the clock in case you need to pay more for parking.

I think, what i'm trying to say here, is there is more you can do here, with less money:) . It is how you are able to enjoy the time you have available. in comparison, I know many London/UK museums are free....but the cost (car parking or tube fare) and hassle (pushchairs, busy roads and underground) of getting there means they are not all that accessible. If you are a person who enjoys retail therapy, NZ is probably not the place for you, but if you find it a refreshing change being able to 'pop out' for an hour with something to do other than wandering round the shops, it can be great.

[ruthyroo]

Quality of life = subjective, personal, hard to measure, varies from person to person. For me it includes things like living a 'simpler life; spending more time with the OH and fewer distractions, living in the country rather than a big city, a more relaxed work environment, doing different stuff like kayaking of a weekend, walking on a beach, having a BBQ on the deck etc. Whether you feel you have a better 'quality of life' often depends very much on what you are coming from and what you are comparing to and what your expectations of NZ are like.

Standard of living = objective, measureable. Examples include salaries and what they buy you, price and range and quality and choice of cars / goods / food / beer etc that is available to spend your money on, quality and type of housing that is available, and at what cost, cost of utilities, cost of travel - and how affordable all these things are in terms of (average) salaries.

So they are quite distinct but very closely linked. People who move to NZ from the UK may be willing to accept a lower standard of living IF they feel that their quality of life has improved enough to accept the trade-off. However, for a lot of people standard of living is part and parcel of their quality of life (what 'toys' they have' what car they drive etc) - and those people will struggle if their standard of living drops, and they don't feel that their quality of life has been compensated for in other ways. And the interesting thing is that it's really hard to tell in advance what way you are going to go. A lot of people describe themselves as non-materialistic, like it's some kind of failing to enjoy having expensive toys / cars / holidays / etc. But it's not a moral choice, it's just the way you are. Different strokes.

[John Z]

Quality of life = subjective, personal, hard to measure, varies from person to person. For me it includes things like living a 'simpler life; spending more time with the OH and fewer distractions, living in the country rather than a big city, a more relaxed work environment, doing different stuff like kayaking of a weekend, walking on a beach, having a BBQ on the deck etc. Whether you feel you have a better 'quality of life' often depends very much on what you are coming from and what you are comparing to and what your expectations of NZ are like.

Standard of living = objective, measureable. Examples include salaries and what they buy you, price and range and quality and choice of cars / goods / food / beer etc that is available to spend your money on, quality and type of housing that is available, and at what cost, cost of utilities, cost of travel - and how affordable all these things are in terms of (average) salaries.

So they are quite distinct but very closely linked. People who move to NZ from the UK may be willing to accept a lower standard of living IF they feel that their quality of life has improved enough to accept the trade-off. However, for a lot of people standard of living is part and parcel of their quality of life (what 'toys' they have' what car they drive etc) - and those people will struggle if their standard of living drops, and they don't feel that their quality of life has been compensated for in other ways. And the interesting thing is that it's really hard to tell in advance what way you are going to go. A lot of people describe themselves as non-materialistic, like it's some kind of failing to enjoy having expensive toys / cars / holidays / etc. But it's not a moral choice, it's just the way you are. Different strokes.

You already made the right distinction between quality of life and standard of living: money, and the irrelevance of money.:nice1

But, it's the same with being materialistic/non-materialistic: many people are not able to look at things (material) and see their qualities, instead they (only can) see the financial value.

It's very easy, very "fast", very "modern", very "2007", even very agressive, to only see the financial value, think in financial values, to only measure in financial values. But at the same time it's so "small" thinking, almost "inhumane".

The "problem" is that in a modern (consumerist) society quality of life costs money, whereas it seems to me that in NZ a lot of (quality of) life can be found without money, but only for people who are able to see it, feel it. When you don't see it, when you don't feel it, when you don't (know how to) respect it, I think you are really poor, no matter how much money you have.

And that kind of being poor is what quality of life, or better, the lack of it, is about.
It's universal, you can put it in any cultural context.

[marky]

Hey,

I see alot of people explaining on here why NZ is right for them, and i see alot of people saying thats its a "better quality of life" or "better standing of living" etc so i was wondering if you could explain what makes it a better quality of life, even when your money doesnt go as far?

we've haven't got a better quality of life in that everyone goes on about the lifestyle...but you need cash for that.

[AlexUK]

Hey,

Well personally i do like money, ive wanted to be rich since i was 4-5 while other kids thought about being a policeman or a fireman. However i dont like spending money, i just would like the fact i dont have to worry about it as i hate to borrow money or be in debt to anyone.

Thats one of the reasons why i think NZ is for me personally, i can do the things i like water sports, extreme sports, skiing/snowboarding that i just cant do in the UK without being rich, on far less income. If i was able to do that having a mansion wouldnt matter (although it would be nice).

However i still think i can make a pretty good living by running my own business even if it is in NZ, so maybe ill have the best of both worlds.

[JoHnH]

Local Kiwi response.

Quality of life? Jeez, mate. This really got to me:

"Sunday afternoon...fancy popping out for couple of hours with kids. In UK, that meant choice of:

1. One of the local towns (for visit to coffee shop or park) and spending alot of money on parking, plus even on Sunday, having to drive round until we find suitable parking space where we can get out of car easily...i.e. 3 kids in carseats!
2. Local stately home/country park grounds/place of interest....expensive car parking/entrance fees etc"

OK, 20 years ago now, but in Auckland if you fancied popping out for a few hours:
Whip the kids off to Piha, watch them nearly drowning in the surf, scoff some fresh-baked bread, go home burned sandy and exhausted.
Or go the other way, watch them donning goggles and making like seals at Muriwai, spending several hours under water.
Long weekend? Borrow your mate's bach at Opoutere, wake up to the Tuis singing, walk for miles on deserted golden sand, Vogel's sandwiches in the secret lagoon.
Or head down to your cousin's bach at Taupo, spend a freezing day on the mountain, stoke up the barbie after for some saussies, sit round the fire thawing out.

or visit the local stately home? Yeah, right.

All of the above done in a 10-year-old Japanese import, instead of the latest Mercedes. But what the hell? Gets you there.

Quality of life? She's getting a bit more crowded here nowadays, but if you don't relate to that sort of thing, why bother coming?

[AlexUK]

Piha awesome beach, went body boarding there was amazing :D

[gil]

Dunno if I'm getting old, but I'm finding it hard to follow some of the posts on here :D
For us, "quality of life" is indeed better here in New Zealand and it includes (but is not limited to):

Living by the sea
Both having jobs, rather than being self employed, which means, for me, working where I live instead of servicing clients all over the UK and Europe
Being around with the family every evening
Having a spa pool and being able to use it 'cos the weather's conducive
Our 16 year old observing that she finds the quality of learning here better because teachers can teach instead of spending time controlling disruptive pupils
The beautiful walks on the doorstep
The opportunity to commute by ferry :D
Far livelier social life than we had in UK (partly because I'm around more)
Easy access to all kinds of shops both locally and in the centre of Auckland
No peer pressure on the kids to look a particular way
Great cultural mix where we live
Discipline in schools
Quality of education
Food and wine :D
Active lifestyleWe definitely had some of those in Cardiff and no doubt we could have achieved others but we felt the cost would have been too high. Having been accused of donning rose-tinted specs in the past, I am proud to present my positive and optimistic view of the quality of life we feel we have here. Does that mean it will work for everyone.....unlikely, but our persepctive is all I can offer.

Gil

[willsken]

Nice post Gil. Well, the quality of my life has also improved here. We don't earn as much money but we are fortunate to earn enough to be comfortably off. Having said that finances weren't an issue in the UK either. What we have gained is a peace I never found in the UK and having a happier mum and wife makes for a happier family all round!

I work at the local college and am home in 2 minutes not the 40 minutes, traffic allowing, it was in the UK. My children have a great social life and are really busy with activities. My youngest gets dropped off at the cinema and watches the film with his friends. I don’t need to be there, you know the staff will watch out for them. Never would he have had the freedom to do that in the UK. They do a paper round, again not in a million years where we lived before. When I say I’m popping to the supermarket, I’m gone 10 minutes at the most. Never took less than an hour in the UK. We are coming out of the winter now (3 1/2 months) the weather at the weekend was glorious and we had our fist BBQ of the season in a huge garden I’ve spent my life dreaming about. We have 2 acres of land and I’m going to be getting a horse. Again, in the UK a dream. I could go on and on about the improvements to our life but I think that paints a bit of a picture.

Reading this forum has taught me one thing, for many people the dream of living in NZ works out. For others it isn’t what they expected or wanted. Mainly it seems to come down to money. If you can afford a good standard of living then quality of life comes into play, if you struggle to make ends meet and can’t afford the basics in life, where’s the quality?