[Leccy-Lee]

So hey yeah, one expects when you move from Ol Blighty to New Zealand and espiecially working in the construction/labour side of life, that you is going to get some abuse as a "Pommy", i had it coming and expected it for sure, but anyone else get so annoyed at times you just sometimes feel like shouting out "give it a bl***y rest Kiwis" ?:confused:

Its not so much the comments and funny remarks, more the fact everything i do at work i seem to get "why the heck you done it like that?..........Oh course must be a brit thing HAHA" :( and things like. and "cant expect him to get it right he is a Pom"

I probably not helped in past week or so, as i getting so frustrated i got point of anwering back with "I done it that way to educate you kiwis on how to do something the right way!" and similar remarks, but i suppose thats just fuelling there fire.

They dont seem to mean any harm (in fact most said with a "only kidding mate" lines) but blimey 40-50 times a day and anyone going to get fed up with the comments.

And to top it the Boss today supplied us all with work shirts with "go the All Blacks....New Zealand" written on the back, and i am trying to politely figure out how to say i would rather not wear it, as its not my team? lol

And another that really annoys, is they really dont get the difference between "English" and "British" do they? Ok maybe i am an old patriotic sod, as even back home i would argue the toss with folk that i am not British but i am English. But here its 10 times worse, they genuinely seem to know no difference? My flatmate says "Yeah but seriously Lee, there is no difference, britain is england? why does it bother you!?"..

So every time someone says "oh he's british" at work etc, i adamantly protest that i am in fact English, and that Britian is actually a union of 4 seperate countries.

So?
Is it just me being pedantic? Or do they ever stop going on about things and all that? And is it every possible to get a Kiwi to recognise that britian and england are NOT the same thing?

/sigh...... Sorry ranting, just bad day, and come home wanting to go to work tomorrow in a full English flag outfit! They might get message!

[Sam B]

They are probably persisting because they can see it winds you up, even if you try to pretend it doesn't. Try to let it go over your head, don't rise, hopefully they'll get bored.

Can't help with the British thing, it's never really bothered me what people think I am. I'm not patriotic at all. I've never understood why it matters?

[BaldyBeardyBloke]

Actually where I work it's almost the other way around.

There are seven of us. One Brit (sorry English - me), one South African, one Septic Tank, sorry, Yank, sorry American, one Maldives fella and only three Kiwi's.

We all take the mick out of each other conatsantly, so it's far from uniquely Kiwi, I think you're just unfortunate to be in such a minority in your particular situation.

Imagine what they'll be like if the AB's actually win the world cup!

[Leccy-Lee]

Yea, good advice Sam. Your right i know.
Just venting a few frustrations after a bad day, and to be fair my first bad day in NZ (not bad for 3mths in)

Yup the English / Brit thing i know a lot of people dont get, as i said i had many a heated discussion back home with fellow brits that thought it was odd, and each to there own for sure. But i was just brought up as "English", always made to see the Georges Cross as my flag, and union jack as not my country or flag at all. Its actually a wierd thing in england, as the Welsh and Scots are 100% adamant they are there own people and want to devolve away from Britian and England and yet only about 30-40% the english (like myself) see ourselves as English. Pretty damn rare to find a scot or welshman saying he is British! And i am not jumping on the recent years bandwagon of st georges cross at sporting events etc, we had a st georges cross flying in our garden since i was about 10yo (now you see where i get it from eh!).

Anyway, i should chillout after today eh! lol

[Leccy-Lee]

Imagine what they'll be like if the AB's actually win the world cup

:exit OMG, hell i think! I know its pretty unlikely sadly but i would SO love the English to win the Cup again, oh the 4 years of winding up in return i could do would be so great!! LOL

[Sam B]

No worries Lee. You know, you sound like a really nice bloke, and in my experience people only take the pee out of people they really like.

[pinkpiggy]

I'm quite lucky where I work. Like Sam in my immediate office there are 3 English (me being one), 1 Scottish, 1 South African, 1 Asian (not sure which country) and 10 Kiwis but overall we have quite a mix including our CEO who is Irish.

[Leccy-Lee]

Yup i work for a very small firm, with only 5 of us in total. Me being the only Non-Kiwi of course..

[katiejay]

I reckon it's more of a bloke thing than a kiwi thing. Blokes seem to have an initiation period, lasting up to the time the next newby arrives to become the butt of everyone's jokes! My husband and my nephews have all experienced this in England whenever they've started a new job (and they're born and bred anglo saxons!). Did you not find the same over here? Currently my husband is having the pee taken out of him because he's grown a beard! You men, I dunno!! Take heart, though, Lee, you'll soon be one of the lads and no doubt get your own back in time!! Roll on revenge, and make it large! :laugh

[aberdian]

try being an Englishman in Scotland. The abuse and mickey taking dies down after....ooh, 10 years or so. Or maybe it doesn't and my skins just got thicker :)

Stick it out mate, it's nothing personal.

[dilanium]

Can you explain to me how you're English but not British? I mean, aren't you both? :confused:

So far as my American education has taught me, Great Britain is made up of England, Scotland, Wales, and part of Ireland. So despite feeling more loyal to your individual locality, isn't everyone one in each of those places British?

Granted, I could understand you getting upset if someone called you scottish (nothing against the scots mind you, but that would just be a completely incorrect statement, like saying I'm from West Virginia or Michigan), but why not British.

Isn't that kind of me saying that I'm an Ohioan but not an American?

[Leccy-Lee]

Can you explain to me how you're English but not British? I mean, aren't you both?

Yes indeed i am, "TECHNICALLY" and sadly my passport states "British".. :(
I never stated i wasnt British, as you say by default i am. Just that i am surely English first, and the country i come from is of course England, (Britian as you say is 4 counties and therefore not a country itself)

I suppose its like if i said "Hi i am a European", which again of course is very true and factually correct i am a european indeed, but europe is of course many many countries and me saying that, i would surely be asked "Ah but which country in Europe?".. Saying Britain is like saying i am from 4 countries (is that possible?) which surely is crazy when the country i come from is England?

As you so well put it yourself mentioning the Scots, the scottish, welsh and irish all have there identities. The world (as yourself etc) recognises "ah look hes a scotsman" or "that chaps welsh" BUT i'd put money on if you met an Englishman youd say "ah hes british".. You see?

Its like England has lost its way, its identity? As a perfect example the local radio here was talking about the Rugby yesterday and i quote the DJ ....
"The scottish, welsh, irish and british all have teams in the world cup this year" Yes he may have just slipped up, but thats the point, what happened to England? We still exist you know :p

Sorry my thoughts difficult to explain, but i hope you get the idea? Yes i am british, as much as am european. But my "country" and my "nationality" are and always will be English to the core. Another little fun fact.. The last UK census in 2001 the forms had tick boxes for nationality and the box said British, the government a year later released details that stated over 60% of forms were "defaced" and british was crossed out and the country was handwritten in (IE: English, Welsh, Scottish etc) SO its not just mad old me, the vast majority of us see ourselves by our nationality and not firstly as british. In fact with "Devolution" in past 10+ years the 4 countries seem to be splitting up more and more again, with there own laws and there own governments etc now, i give it another 100 years and the 4 countries may again be seperate identities?

Anyway, i never meant to turn this thread into the english/british discussion, it just amazes me how half the world seems ignorant (not all for sure before my head gets bitten off, but many) to the fact that Britain is not the same as England..

Here ends my rant :cheers

[Leccy-Lee]

Anyhow going back to my original point (Kiwis etc)

I know they only having a laugh, and its all work banter, think i just had a bad day. Like i say 50+ jives in any given day is enough to annoy anyone, even if just for fun! lol

[Jo Jo]

Ah Lee, I hope you had a nice relaxing evening in the end!

I think you're fighting a losing battle with the English not British thing, though - once you're out of the UK everyone will call you a Brit whether you like it or not - I think you just have to grin and bear it!!

Dilanium - I'm not surprised you're confused!

Great Britain is made up of England, Scotland and Wales. The United Kingdom is made up of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Our passports are UK passports and these state that we are British Citizens (even though part of the UK isn't in Great Britain!) So, technically, everyone from Great Britain is British, but some people prefer to be called English, Welsh or Scottish.

Northern Ireland is a bit more tricky. People who live there are entitled to hold a UK or an Irish passport (or both). Some people in NI call themselves British and some Irish, and some people can get quite irate if you call them British when they consider themselves Irish and vice versa.

[Leccy-Lee]

My last comments on England discussion, But....
Should anyone be interested i just googled these:

http://www.thecep.org.uk/index.shtml
http://crossofstgeorge.net/

Some Quotes:
There has been a decisive resurgence in English self-identification and awareness. This tide will not be turned back. The English flag is now everywhere. Love of England is as legitimate as love of Scotland and Wales. The people of England include everyone for whom England is both their home and future

67% want an English Parliament

Devolution has created a United Kingdom in which Scotland and Wales have national executives while England does not

Dr Johnson once called patriotism "The last refuge of the scoundrel". Which probably explains why the English have never really been as good at being patriotic as some other nations. but in the 7 years since this site became active more and more English sites have appeared, let's claim our flag and our national day on 23rd April, Saint George's day!

[Leccy-Lee]

try being an Englishman in Scotland. The abuse and mickey taking dies down after....ooh, 10 years or so. Or maybe it doesn't and my skins just got thicker :)

LOL yes i can see, how that must be hard work, so you know whats under s Scotsmans Kilt then? :laugh

[granger]

Hi Lee,

I'm Scottish and I've been called English, British, A Pom and a Scotty. I never try to correct anyone when they say something that isn't quite right - they always find out "the truth" one way or another.

So?
Is it just me being pedantic? Or do they ever stop going on about things and all that? And is it every possible to get a Kiwi to recognise that britian and england are NOT the same thing?

"Englishness" as opposed to "Britishness" is obviously something you're passionate about but I think, in New Zealand, you're right when you wonder if it might be a bit pedantic.

I take the view that there's no point me harping on about something that they're not overly interested in. I've never been ribbed either - except maybe a little when the rugby's on - but the little there is is light hearted and good natured. I'm sure it's the fact that I'm easy going about the nationality thing that stops the ribbing. If it was something I obviously was passionate about I think I'd get more ribbing.

Imagine the shoe on the other foot. Image you're working in a team of all English people and a Kiwi joins the team. On hearing the accent, you call him an Ozzy by mistake. He reacts with an explanation of how New Zealand is completely different from Australia, they're two different countries, with different histories and so on. If he just said, with a smile, nah mate, my team wears black - he'd be a lot less likely to be ribbed about it in future.

Don't know if any of that helps but keep your pecker up and you'll get there in the end. :cheers

[Moorf]

It wasn't until I came here that I realised how annoying it must have been for the Kiwis and Aussies that used to come to temp with us in London - if they didn't get "fush and chups" or "yis" etc thrown at them by several people more than a few times a day they were lucky! Took a move here to be the "odd one out" to appreciate it though!

Yeah, they love a good banter and joke - and depending on how you react depends on how much more you get. Judging by your piccy (if that's you!) you have a friendly face and smile which couldn't offend! Mind you, on a bad day it can grind and be an effort to grin and bear it! She'll be right!! :p

[dilanium]

Okay, I understand now. Thanks!

[wiki]

As a Kiwi who has been asked if I'm:

a) Australian
b) Canadian
c) South African

90% of my time in the UK I'd advise you on the Britishness point to just suck it up. Like someone said above, Kiwis don't tend to care that there's a distinction between English and British because they have term no term of reference. And even if you tell them there is a different they just won't see it as any sort of big deal. The only thing I'd suggest is ribbing them in the same manner about their Australian drawl (we kiwis hate that) and don't call kiwis descendents of convicts since we're all from missionary stock - honest!

As for the ribbing - that comes from being the odd one out, and not just because you're English. If you were the only Southlander in the team and rolled your Rs they'd get you for that to. My advice is to give as good as you get, but be light-hearted about it. They're not being malicious - but if it ever feels like they are then you should be talking to Human Resources about it, or perhaps looking for a better employer!

Best of luck - it's not easy being somewhere new, but remember that if they really didn't like you they'd probably ignore you all together.

[willsken]

Hi Lee.

I think it's all been covered but I'll add my bit anyway! :yes

We have a lot of Brits (all different varieties) working at the school and there is quite a bit of micky taking about it. (The headmaster calls us his imports and there is often comments re sport "Bloody Brits!! etc) I have never heard it done in a malicious way, ever. I don't suppose it's any different when I'm talking to a Kiwi and I laughingly yip yip yip at them! They take that in the jokey way it's meant and normally just give back a little jibe about being from UK. (England and Wales me). I think it was Sam who made the point about being patriotic making it harder for you. I’m not and I couldn’t care less about the comments which helps me see it as a joke. I’m sure if you just relax and don’t let it bother you they will stop doing it as much. If you don’t bite then there will be no point in them winding you up!!:)

[Chiba]

Lee, it could be worse - people could always be thinking you're a Yank! I've been enduring that for 10 years now. It's understandable, there being a lot more Americans in Japan than Brits, but still. :mad: Now when people say it, and they always do so in English for some reason, I reply in Japanese that I'm French and don't speak English. Confuses the **** out of 'em! :laugh

Tell people you're from the Isle of Man?

[Carol]

I absolutely love to tell kiwis who refer to me as a Brit or a pom that I am neither.

I am a geordie.
(Said with broadest geordie accent I can muster)


They have absolutely no idea what I am talking about so usually shut up.
(Most of them never having been north of Watford when on their OE ;-) )

:cheers

[speckythecky]

Love that answer Carol,

Its hard enough trying to explain where anywhere is in UK. I have tried saying that warrington is between Liverpool and Manchester, but have given that up and now say a few miles north of London.

[kellyfamily]

Gotta laugh at this thread . Someone will always take the mickey out of anyone from foreign lands , i was asked at my job interview if i was worried about people taking the mickey and i just laughed as im the worlds worst for taking the mickey. They are all confused at work as i tell them im half Maori , half chinese and half Irish :)
Patriotic? Hell no otherwise i wouldnt be here , Still love English football and rugby because its what i was brought up on (always ask the question which stage will the AB`s bottle in this world cup:) )
Enjoy the banter i do.
I have strong mancunian accent too and am always asked if im from liverpool or Scotland so i once again say im a chinaman from Bejing.

[ellenmelon]

As a Kiwi who has been asked if I'm:

a) Australian
b) Canadian
c) South African..

:) me too! when i was living in ireland..

[Nettie 2]

Hi Lee,
You sound so like my ex hubby with the English thing. He was adamant that he was English not British and it must have rubbed off on me cos I now think the same! I didn't think I was particularly patriotic until I came to live here and was watching a show of ozzy & NZ comedians who were constantly taking the pee out of the poms. My hackles rose and I was smarting, but as I was in a room of kiwis (partner included) I had to suffer in silence!! But my reaction really surprised me as I can usually take stick well (and give it!:laugh )
Anyway boy, you look like you have a good sense of humour from your photo so I'm sure you'll survive and laugh it off. And don't forget to give what you get!! We're all allowed a rant occasionally. :yes

[Aussie Pom]

When you look at your passport it is a British passport. Well actually I suppose they are European these days. England is part of Britain and the United Kingdom and besides English people aren't supposed to get upset about being "misplaced". You are only allowed to be upset if you are Scottish, Irish or Welsh and mistaken for English or a Kiwi who is mistaken for an Aussie or an Canadian who is mistaken for a Yank.:laugh
So you can still be English but you are a British too so technically they are right to say you are British.

However I was surprised that the English are still called POMS over in NZ as I thought that was reserved for English in Oz as there weren't any penal colonies there. I would have thought that the Kiwis would have come up with something more original.:laugh

Also if I was you I would buy myself an England shirt and wear it for Friday night drinks as revenge for having to wear the All Blacks shirt.

My husband wears his Wallaby shirt to wind me up all the time...he's a
"Born Again Aussie" soon to be a "Born Again Kiwi", but I had the last laugh when we won the last World Cup.

Maybe that will be the ultimate revenge if it happens again.

Gina