[kidco]

Hi,

I am a mathematics teacher, with experience at the secondary and tertiary levels, presently in Canada.

My query here is actually not about NZ - I am curious to know about what it's like to teach in the UK, because I am also considering taking a teaching assignment over there.

I reckon that many on this list would have some insight into this - from those moving away from the UK, going back, and still there. I learned firsthand about how a great-sounding teaching position overseas can in reality be a very tough assignment, from previous overseas teaching experience.

Why are there so many teaching jobs in the UK, especially those advertised for overseas teachers?

What does it mean when a posting says "140 pounds/day"? Is that times 5 times 52 weeks, or (I am guessing) just times the number of school days in the year?

Do they tend to provide good relocation/accommodation assistance?

How are working conditions in UK schools? What's it like compared with NZ schools?

Kind regards,

Kidco

[andrewandjane]

On the whole it depends where you teach, look closely at the schools offsted report (can find these on the net)

i'll point out i'm biased and readily admit i'd rather chew off my own leg than teach secondary kids in the UK again!!!!

good luck

[Debbie P.]

OMG... good luck! There's a good reason why there's so many jobs available for overseas teachers :exit

That being said, there ARE good schools out there - usually the private or grammar schools ... it's just that their teachers tend to stay long-term, so the jobs aren't readily available.

Another problem is that, ironically, the employment market is saturated - you wouldn't think so, but it is! I know a few teachers who are having problems getting permanent work. As a result, schools can pick and choose. Often, they will choose newly qualified teachers (known as NQTs) over more experienced ones if they want to save money.

Sometimes, those NQTs find they cannot cope, leave by Christmas, and then the schools are trawling the supply agencies looking for replacements... which is where more experienced overseas teachers come in, i.e. teachers not looking for permanent work, just some seasonal temporary work. The teachers often come from OZ, NZ and SA.

My OH is probably resigned to his lot(!), but he has commented that S. African teachers in particular are shocked by the standard of behaviour in the UK. He gets the impression that children and parents, in SA at least, have a more respectful relationship with their teachers. However, he hasn't worked anywhere but the UK, so it's only speculation.

Per day is likely to be the number of days in the school year - 'supply' teachers don't usually get paid for holidays. Having said that, if this is a 'long-term' supply post, e.g. 1 academic year or maybe 2 terms, the agencies often pay a slight retainer for school vacations, just in encourage the supply teacher to stay in the post. Also, agency pay is slightly higher than the normal school salary, again to attract good teachers to work for the supply agency. The other type of supply is where you are literally waiting for calls about work each day - in that situation you would only be paid for days worked.

Hope this gives you some idea!

[willsken]

I would say that teaching in a UK school would vary a lot, according to where the school is and how strong a management team they have. There are good schools but I would be very careful about taking the position without knowing a lot more about the school first. To teach in a tough school is hard but to teach maths in a tough school could be hell! I think you also need to look at yourself as a teacher, if you are very strong and don't struggle with discipline maybe you'd survive the experience. :D

In my last school over there, and I'd worked in a lot worse, we had an American teacher over on exchange and he couldn't wait to go back to the States. He couldn't believe the awful behavior of the kids. :exit

[willsken]

Bit of a You Tube laugh for you! :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxSSO1-zEq0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxB1gB6K-2A

[kidco]

Thanks for the replies to my query, to Debbie, Nicola, and andrewandjane. Good bit of reality check there...definitely can see the correlation between the school's desperation and the direness of teaching conditions.

The Catherine Tate videos pretty much sum it all up, methinks...

Kind regards,

Kidco

[David with a dream]

My OH is a secondry school teacher and really enjoys her 'lot' most of the time. Every school has good/bad kids just like every school (the world over) has good/bad teachers. I've read so much over the years about secondry school kids and as my eldest child is due to start secondry school I was really worried. I went to the open evening at the school she will be atending from next September and was really surprised by some of the kids who showed me around, really really nice young people.
My wife is always saying that a good teacher can cope in any school as they will find ways to engage the kids.
The £140 is supply teacher pay and you will not be paid in school holidays.

Check the ofsted results as mentioned and don't worry the kids won't bite:D

Cheers..........David

[Debbie P.]

My wife is always saying that a good teacher can cope in any school as they will find ways to engage the kids.


Ouch! Guaranteed to make my OH feel pretty inadequate, despite his 18 years' experience!

He wouldn't agree with that - he says you can be as engaging and inspirational as you like but it won't make any difference if you don't have strong senior teachers prepared to back you up. For example, if you have a very difficult pupil who should be excluded and is not. So, personally, I'd be trying to gauge the 'atmosphere' of the school at my interview, much as anyone does during a job interview, teacher or not.

At a previous school, he had to go into another classroom to talk down a large 16 year old boy who was holding a chair in his hand and threatening to throw it at my OH's heavily pregnant colleague, all because she had confiscated the boy's mobile phone out of desperation. So are you suggesting that she deserved that treatment because she wasn't 'engaging' the boy's cooperation? :no

[CjChris]

I taught in the US for over 10 years, and I consider myself very capable of engaging and holding students' attention; however, there are some kids, some classes, some dynamics that defy every bit of knowledge and training expertise one is armed with....so, that being said, I'm way over feeling like I have to put on the dog and pony show for teenagers to get them to be interested in learning to write a coherent paragraph. Sheesh....Makes me shiver thinking about going back to that....:exit

[IanW99]

...
Check the ofsted results as mentioned and don't worry the kids won't bite:D

Cheers..........David

Are you sure, I wouldn't trust some of the kids not to bite :exit

Ian

[willsken]

Have to say I agree with the others. I think there are kids out there who do "bite" and in some schools there are far far too many of that type of kid. I agree that a good teacher will engage and inspire a lot of kids but if you teach in some of the schools out there, it won't happen. The kids don't want to know. I used to struggle teaching in the afternoon at my first school, the kids were stoned off their faces after lunch break! Not a lot you could do to inspire them. :exit

It always amazes me how a school can pull out all the stops on an open evening and make a school look good. Even I was impressed with the school I taught in on open nights! (Not much at other times!) :D

We were sat talking about some unruley kids this morning and one of the group (happened to be 4 of us from the UK) said "God, we moan, could you imagine going back and teaching in the UK?" Colecive shudder from all of us. I think that has to say something about teaching in the UK.

I just want add to what I've already said in this thread. There are some really good schools out there in the UK and if you get a job in one of them, great you'll love it because there are lovely kids in the UK to. Just be careful and do your reseach because if you get a job in a bad/hard school you could well be eaten for breakfast! Seen it happen to a few good teachers in my time. :(

[Ruta]

Turning the subject around , I'm a primary school teacher hoping to move to NZ - any advice gratefully recieved. I mainly work with KS1 (4-7yrs) and have had a lot of experience with children with 'challenging behaviour'. I see that there a shortage of early years teachers. What are the particular qualifications for early years?

[JandM]

Hello, and welcome to the forum.:) I'm sure people already in NZ will be along with some answers for you.

[Carey]

Early Yrs, you need the Early Childhood Education qualification, only offered in NZ and no equivalent anywhere else. You can be employed without it but most employers are very reluctant or refuse because they can't claim funding for you so can't pay you! Unqualified pay is very little, about $15 to $21 per hr. You can do a one yr graduate diploma for ECE offered by Auckland Uni, Christchurch Uni and Massey Uni but places are limited adn very over subscribed as by 2012 all early childhood staff must have this or ahve studied a degree in EC. However I have an interivew on Tues for a place at Auckland Uni so will let you know if i get a place!

[lockstock]

I would say that teaching in a UK school would vary a lot, according to where the school is and how strong a management team they have. There are good schools but I would be very careful about taking the position without knowing a lot more about the school first. To teach in a tough school is hard but to teach maths in a tough school could be hell! I think you also need to look at yourself as a teacher, if you are very strong and don't struggle with discipline maybe you'd survive the experience. :D





This is so true I thought it was worth reading again. Be very careful where you apply. The same goes for here in NZ but the TKI site gove you a huge amount of info on each school and it's worth checking them out.