[tigerlily]

I'll be looking for rentals in Welly soon, and I'm wondering about the pros and cons of the night store/heat pump/gas heater- what are these things? I'm only familiar with lovely central heating either gas or oil. When I was a kid we heated with a woodstove, and I'm comfortable with that, though it's kind of messy and a pain! But central heating seems to be almost unheard of in rentals.

Also, how common is insulation in rental houses?

[ruthyroo]

Ho ho ho (hollow laughter)

I think there are probably lots of threads about heating / lack of heating but FWIW in my experience most rentals (indeed most NZ houses) have very little in the way of insulation and the main form of heating you will find is a woodburner. We've lived in three rentals in NZ so far (all three bed and in pretty good nick otherwise) and they had:

1. No double glazing, no insulation. Only heating was a gas fire in the living room, a tiny wood stove in the kitchen and a wall mounted one-bar radiator in the bathroom. We froze to bits, all our jumpers went mouldy within about 4 weeks from the damp.

2. Architect designed - good single glazing and floor to ceiling windows to catch the sun, one massive woodburner but again no insulation. So it got cold pretty fast once the sub went in.

3. No double glazing, no insulation. Only heating is a woodburner in the living room. During the winter we basically live in one room which is heated to supernova temps, while the rest of the house is an icebox and going for a pee in the night is a major hassle. In the summer we do get a lot of sun (when it shines) and the house gets warm but when it disappears over the horizon - the house is cold within half an hour due to the total lack of insulation.

A colleague at work who has a number of rental properties tells me that landlords generally do not see either insulation or heating as cost-effective investments - sadly

[tigerlily]

<insert naive wish here> wouldn't it be nice if the government put in some sort of incentive for landlords to do insulation/better heating?

So what should I be looking for? If there is no insulation, central heating will cost a fortune because you'll loose it all!

[IanW99]

Our rental in the Wellington area came with insulation and gas central heating, didn't have double glazing and did accept pets, so they are out there if you look around (wasn't the cheaper end of the market though).

If you are looking for rentals in the Wellington region though, the best thing to do is make sure that it gets a lot of sun, many houses are in the shade for a large part of the day so are more damp and cost more to heat.

Ian

[Nathan]

Our rental in the Wellington area came with insulation and gas central heating, didn't have double glazing and did accept pets, so they are out there if you look around (wasn't the cheaper end of the market though).

If you are looking for rentals in the Wellington region though, the best thing to do is make sure that it gets a lot of sun, many houses are in the shade for a large part of the day so are more damp and cost more to heat.

Ian

Yes!! The sun thing is important in Welly.

We managed to find a place with very good exposure all day long. Good curtains keep heat in at night and also reflect unwanted heat on warm days.
It still suffers from poor insulation and single glazing, but has night store heaters in the lower level....which heats the upper floor by convection. It requires a lot more thought and attention than setting the thermosat!!

Basically, the night store heaters heat a reservoir of oil(?) at night (off peak) and release it during the day.

[Lupin]

Old villas can be unbelievably cold. Ours was so cold it almost hurt in the morning so we went outside to warm up- like a fridge!

Consequently I have become quite paranoid and bought top end pink batts for the whole house we're building plus underfloor insulation.

Look for a house
that is cooler than outside when you go into it but is not in the shade (ETA: because you're looking in summer- obviously not if it would be winter!)
is north facing
is carpeted in bedrooms
has decent thick/thermal curtains
has smaller rooms with lower ceiling for cheaper heating
Don't rush into something with a heat pump or gas fire as neither alone solve the winter coldness. Better would be well insulated, north facing, decent solid fuel stove, small bedrooms not far from the heat source.

Purchase top end electric blankets while you're still fresh off the boat and everything looks cheap.

[Georgebulldog]

This is all very worrying as I hate the cold & have a baby due in June, we're arriving in January.

Are any of you in Wellington able to tell us which parts of Wellington to avoid becasue of being in the shade of mounains/hills? Or is this obvious once you get there?

Thank you

[IanW99]

This is all very worrying as I hate the cold & have a baby due in June, we're arriving in January.

Are any of you in Wellington able to tell us which parts of Wellington to avoid becasue of being in the shade of mounains/hills? Or is this obvious once you get there?

Thank you

Most of Wellington is built on or around hills so it's not really possible to say which areas are best or should be avoided as there is likely to be some good and some bad in each area.

For some houses it is obvious that they will be in shade for much of the day and others it is clear that they will catch the sun most of the time, but for the rest you really need to check for yourself. In particular, check early in the day and also later as it's possible for a house to be in full sun all morning and by early afternoon in shade.

If you are looking in the summer, it's more difficult as the arc that the sun makes in the sky is much bigger than in the winter so it is much harder to determine if it will get good sun in winter as well as summer.

Ian

[Georgebulldog]

Thanks Ian
Must try & remember that now

[Woolfie]

Just a quick question,how cold does it get in winter. Are we talking below zero at night or slightly higher. I presume that due to the lack of insulation,the effect of the cold is felt more.

kind regards

Woolfie

[blearyjane]

Sounds cold!!! What about houses that you buy - is the heating/insulation any better?

[tigerlily]

That might depend on the age of the house and how much you are willing to pay. The benefit is that if you put in the insulation you'll get the value of it on resale and for the years you live there.

I haven't seen much on here about leaky house syndrome for a while - that is a problem you should be aware of if you are buying especially.

[clg]

Newer houses do tend to have insulation, ours was built mid 70's and does. You sometimes see old villas that have been very refurbished and insulated but these are quite expensive, but beautiful. Around Wellington the outlying areas, Kapiti and Upper Hutt, have newer houses while areas closer to the CBD have older houses. Those are generalisations of course though and it is not always like that.

What ever type of heating make sure you find a place that does have at least a good heat source for the living area either a fire or heat pump. Wood or pellet fires put out a lot of heat but don't get the whole house except in some really well designed ones, kiwis use space heaters for the bedrooms. Wood costs less than a heatpump but is more of a hassle.

As others have said, sun is also important but if you have excellent sun but poor insulation and space heaters you will not be happy!

The pickier you can be the better off you will be and it does not seem all that uncommon for people to do a short lease and plan on moving when they can't find something they want. I also know of someone who agreed to a long lease in exchange for the landlord to do some extra work on the house.

There are houses here with central heat, they do cost more but it does exist. Try a key word search on trademe for central heating.

[IanW99]

Just a quick question,how cold does it get in winter. Are we talking below zero at night or slightly higher. I presume that due to the lack of insulation,the effect of the cold is felt more.

kind regards

Woolfie

You haven't speciified which part of NZ you are interested in.

For Wellington region it can go down to below zero occasionally but is quite rare i.e. you may sometimes wake up to ice on the windscreen.

The lack of insulation and central heating are the main reasons you notice the cold more.

Ian

[Familyofmonkeys]

We have just moved out of a rental in Auckland. The house wasn't that old....1980's, but had no insulation or heating at all. It caught the sun all day long, but it was about 6 degrees in the mmornings on the coldest days. We basically lived in one room all day and heated it with a halogen heater as they are FAR cheaper to run than the oil radiators you see everywhere. We also had a halogen heater on one bar all night in the bedrooms to try and maintain a temp of about 15 degrees. Baby had to share bed with us as it was far too cold for him in his cot. Also....really hard to get washing dry over winter. Had to use tumble dryer for everything, even towels after having shower!

Now in new house with insulation and even though it is warm weather, you can really tell the difference. It doesn't feel like walking into a greenhouse when you come in from the sun outside!

[Mels]

Our rental in the Wellington area came with insulation and gas central heating, didn't have double glazing and did accept pets, so they are out there if you look around (wasn't the cheaper end of the market though).

If you are looking for rentals in the Wellington region though, the best thing to do is make sure that it gets a lot of sun, many houses are in the shade for a large part of the day so are more damp and cost more to heat.

Ian

Ian when you say 'not cheaper end of market' what sort of rent/week would we expect to pay for central heating etc. (three beds karori sort of area)
I was wondering if an appartment in a new block would be a compramise for a few months - would they be warmer?

[tigerlily]

Mels I was wondering about apartments too. It's hard to find one with 3 bedrooms though- not impossible, just not as many as the 2 bedrooms.

I've searched for "central heating" on trade me and found mostly upward from $550 per week for anything that had central heating. I've had my eye on rentals for a while and I've seen a couple in the $450 range that had it as well- but much more rare!

[kanatakiwi]

We basically lived in one room all day and heated it with a halogen heater as they are FAR cheaper to run than the oil radiators you see everywhere. We also had a halogen heater on one bar all night in the bedrooms to try and maintain a temp of about 15 degrees.

any suggestions as to the best type and brand of halogen heater?

[kanatakiwi]

Has anyone tried a Pellet stove? I was told they are more "heat efficient" so am wondering about them, plus I wonder how getting a wood stove would affect our house insurance, I think it says no wood fires.

also we had a guy in to quote us on this new idea on double glazing where they just add a second pane of glass to your existing windows and its much cheaper than getting new double glazed windows. (They are fixed permanently to the windows, this is not the old storm windows we are familiar with in north america ) Their promotional material claims it works just as well as the full double glazing. The price seems quite reasonable and the guy said we could do one room at a time if our finances would not permit doing the full job all at once (which it wouldn't :no )

I am just trying to figure out a plan, we need to do something before next winter as although we get a lot of sun and its quite warm during the day, its the evenings and mornings and the rainy days that are the worst, especially for someone used to having central heating. A furnace! that seems to be an unheard of thing here!
ps our house was built in 1990 and to me it seems like what we knew as "summer cottages"

[IanW99]

Ian when you say 'not cheaper end of market' what sort of rent/week would we expect to pay for central heating etc. (three beds karori sort of area)
I was wondering if an appartment in a new block would be a compramise for a few months - would they be warmer?

The rental properties we were looking at were 'build to rent' so were brand new with 5 bedrooms and at todays rate would be at least NZ$500 per week. So would agree with tigerlily on approx costs.

If you can find an apartment then I would expect that to be warmer and cheaper to heat than a house (and cheaper to rent).

From the new builds we have seen, gas ducted central heating is common, but we've also seen some older homes with it installed so it doesn't necessarily have to be a new build.

Best advice would be to check out all the rentals you see as they may not have central heating but still be ok. For example, gas fires or heat pumps in all the main living areas.

Ian

[IanW99]

...
also we had a guy in to quote us on this new idea on double glazing where they just add a second pane of glass to your existing windows and its much cheaper than getting new double glazed windows. (They are fixed permanently to the windows, this is not the old storm windows we are familiar with in north america ) Their promotional material claims it works just as well as the full double glazing. The price seems quite reasonable and the guy said we could do one room at a time if our finances would not permit doing the full job all at once (which it wouldn't :no )
...


Have you seen this post http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showpost.php?p=163718&postcount=32 by wilson182 on this type of double glazing.

Ian

[kanatakiwi]

thanks for the info. I just upped your rep!

[ruthyroo]

<insert naive wish here> wouldn't it be nice if the government put in some sort of incentive for landlords to do insulation/better heating?

So what should I be looking for? If there is no insulation, central heating will cost a fortune because you'll loose it all!

There is some govt funding available for retrospective insulation of housing, but it is focused (appropriately) towards low-income / pensioners etc, many of whom suffer health problems as a result of living in freezing, damp houses. In Dunedin there has just been a project to insulate around 280 of these houses - and frankly that is a drop in the ocean!

Landlords will not do it because they see little financial benefit in doing so - how many years will it take to make back the cost of fitting insulation or a heat pump? Most Kiwi's who are renting just accept that houses are cold and damp, that you live in one room during the winter, that you get 'rugged up' indoors, that you make the most of the free sunshine and that you basically tough it out. So it's only us Brits / Yanks who are arriving from places where heating / insulation are the norm that are asking these questions.

It's a sair fecht and one of the most unattractive things about living in NZ for me.