[Cynicoren]

Hello,

I am looking for an immigration agent that also help to find a job, or one that knows whether I have a chance of finding a job in NZ.
I know only one for now, but I don't know how reliable is he.

Thank you

[ourquest]

but I don't know how reliable is he.


It all comes down to whether or not he is more reliable than you. Most opinion is that you should not use an agent, particularly since NZIS is very transparent with their policy and procedure.
Finding a job, if you are to use an agent of any kind, is best left to an employment agent. Search out some job websites, like www.seek.co.nz and this will guide you whether there are positions for your particular BA/MBA combination. Jobs are easier to land once you are in NZ (by all accounts), your first step should always be assertaining if you are eligible to become an immigrant, via points etc. Have you done all of that part yet?

[tigerlily]

I second the "don't use an agent" - I've read a lot of horror stories here about people being very disappointed with how little work the agent did and out quite a lot of money. Try asking here about your prospects- post in the working in nz section about your background and years of experience. You may well find someone here with leads or suggestions of where to look for jobs.

[Hesh]

Cynicoren,

I totally agree with Ourquest and Tigerlily..was myself thinking of using an agent but decided to give a shot myself.. NZIS is very transparent and thanks to this forum, I could get all the required info. have been interviewed by the CO and awaiting the decision..(I had found the interview questions on the forum itself)..

Search on this forum and you will find a lot of info.. probably many people on this forum know more than the agents.. just keep one thing in mind... keep helping others on this forum..

[martin&maria]

hi we used NZ4U very good but we seem to be in the minority and this forum is very helpful but the option is there to check them out

[Moorf]

I read about NewJobz in the Press yesterday, an immigration agent in Chch, who has just gone under owing immigrants hundreds of thousands of dollars.

They're called NewJobZ

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/thepress/4324315a24035.html

[ourquest]

I read about NewJobz in the Press yesterday, an immigration agent in Chch, who has just gone under owing immigrants hundreds of thousands of dollars.

They're called NewJobZ

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/thepress/4324315a24035.html

Wonder how much of the $600K the directors managed to siphon off into untouchable trust funds or something similar? It is always possible that it all went pear-shaped for them, but it sounds like liquidation by design to me. And here is the catch question when it comes to agents in general, are they working for you or for themselves? When you tackle the process yourself you at least have no doubt where your allegiance lies...

[Moorf]

When you tackle the process yourself you at least have no doubt where your allegiance lies...

Nicely put...

[kanatakiwi]

Hello,

I am looking for an immigration agent that also help to find a job, or one that knows whether I have a chance of finding a job in NZ.
I know only one for now, but I don't know how reliable is he.

Thank you

Well you don't say where you located so it would be hard for anyone to recommend an agent in your area. That said, I agree it's not necessary to have an agent to make this application, and some charge thousands of dollars which would be better spent on the move. I understand some people are "challenged " by paperwork and forms and if you are one of those maybe it would help you to have an agent, but keep in mind,you still have to get all the paperwork together, the agent can't track down your certificates or take your medical for you or get your police clearance, you still have to do most of the work yourself, the agent provides advice on what to say on the form. If its the lack of job you are thinking about , best to check an employment agent or agency, there are lots of them here and you would soon find out about work prospects in your chosen field ( you don't say what that is either)

Good luck with your decision.
kanata kiwi

[Jamie Smith]

I second the "don't use an agent" - I've read a lot of horror stories here about people being very disappointed with how little work the agent did and out quite a lot of money. Try asking here about your prospects- post in the working in nz section about your background and years of experience. You may well find someone here with leads or suggestions of where to look for jobs.

...equally, there are a lot of horror stories about people who failed because they didn't get good advice. And no, I'm not a migration agent :-)

However good intentioned, I think it's risky and a bit negligent to encourage people to DIY when nothing is known about their family circumstances, medical situation, skills and abilities, previous migration history, country of origin, self confidence and importantly, their ability not to assume anything.

There is no downside for the advice giver in giving bad advice and getting it wrong here, but the cost to the person who was encouraged to DIY would be enormous. By all means encourage DIY but only after asking a bunch of questions and being very sure of your answers (not just a sample set of one!).

If an agent acted like that they would not survive and most likely end up in front of the courts.

Forums are great sources of advice, but as there is no recourse for people who read and act on the advice contained here, I think the contributors should be aware of the effect of getting it wrong.

And yes, there are some useless agents out there, part of the reason why the Govt wants a regulation scheme, but by asking around and getting a few different opinions from different sources, the risk is reduced.

[Jamie Smith]

Wonder how much of the $600K the directors managed to siphon off into untouchable trust funds or something similar? It is always possible that it all went pear-shaped for them, but it sounds like liquidation by design to me. And here is the catch question when it comes to agents in general, are they working for you or for themselves? When you tackle the process yourself you at least have no doubt where your allegiance lies...

Looks like a major skills failure inside the company.

a) not to have modelled the effect of various failure rates before offering the refund.
b) let things run on too long before acting to stop the slide in debt from getting any worse.
c) failed to communicate with customers, and what might see them before the courts:
d) they appear to have continued to take in funds when the business may have been insolvent.

They would have done well to have recruited some of their own applicants who had stronger management and finance skills....

[ourquest]

Hi Jamie, thanks for your input.

Regarding your first post, I believe you offer a balanced and professional view, and I have to agree that incorrect information finds its way into the forum fairly regularly. However, in defence of the forum as a source of advice, it is naturally self-regulating. As soon as someone posts incorrect information (with the best intentions I am sure) then the next post will counter this advice. Your own post is a prime example of this. Each question on the forum receives its answer via the entire thread, which statistically will (almost always) be fairly accurate. Not that there are necessarily 21 posts (which would technically make it statistically acceptable) but there are many more than 21 viewings by contributors, who will immediately post if they feel their information is more accurate.

What contributors are after on this forum is personal empowerment. By being a contributor it forces you to really know your subject, see it from different viewpoints and thereby learn enough to be a teacher of the subject. And the desire is also to empower those using the forum passively, and I suppose one of the criticisms of agents is that they take away a degree of control over the migration process, which will admittedly suit some but not others, or as you point out, might be needed in complex cases. Choosing which agent to use in these circumstances will always remain a lottery for the individual, however, and broad advice would have to be to keep totally on top of the process yourself even if using an agent. Knowledge is certainly a form of power.

Regarding the article describing the Migration Agents owing $600K, I find it highly suspicious that they liquidated a first company, only to continue trading as a second company (making promises to the previous clients but not holding themselves financially responsible) and then liquidating the second company. But then, this article is in the press, and information to be found in newspapers is at least as innaccurate as any particular post on a forum.

Thanks again for promoting thought and giving balance to the thread.

[kanatakiwi]

I too found your post thoughtful and balanced and I thought you spoke from considerable experience. So I checked your website and saw that you are in the business of providing business plans for people immgrating to NZ as Business Migrants or LTBV. Now this is useful and I think if I were attempting to immigrate to NZ under these categories I might want to seek professional help also. So I hope you stick around the forum and offer(free) advice to people considering this avenue for migration.

I did however think it would have been more upfront for you to say all this rather than say you are not an immigration agent. True you aren't but you are in that business and you work regularly with immgration agents for people coming in under the business category. That information might have been more helpful to the discussion.

[Sam B]

Well I waded through all the paperwork and found a job and got PR just before I found this forum, dammit. All without an agent, it's possible to do it just by reading the NZIS website (yawn) and a couple of good books. Got my job off the Ministry of Education website jobs vacancies bit. It was a right headache at first, but I got there and saved lots of money by not being tempted by an agent. It can be done, with forum or without.

[Chiba]

This may prove useful in future, if you do decide you want advice:

http://www.iaa.govt.nz/

[Jamie Smith]

Hello Kanatakiwi

Nothing was being withheld. My messages all get posted with "show signature" ticked, but for some reason it's not doing so (moderators, help!). The signature says we do business plans but I'm not allowed to say more, or publicly advertise my business in the forum or use an extended signature file. Thanks for promoting it anyway! Alternatively anyone could find out more info checking out my public profile.

For the record, I've fixed many done by business owners about their won business, and by accountants who should know better. The first problems I can understand as only about 5-10% of people ever try to write their own biz plans so many are not familiar with them.

But accountants should know these things are more than a set of numbers borrowed from some other client's business with a few words thrown together. The best thing they can do is refer the client elsewhere's rather than charge fees for something they can't do to a professional standard.

Same goes for using an agent or not, the person seeking answers will have to decide whether or not the forums posts are useful, given that they may be provided by someone with completely different needs and understanding.

A truce? May I suggest that those who are anti agent be not so enthusiastic about encouraging people to not take professional advice, you don't know what problems you might be creating (for which you can't be held accountable!), rather just try to put the opinion out there and let the newbie decide whether or not they still need paid for help. Moderation, moderation....

My contributions are made as being a part of the industry, it provides me with a living so I don't mind passing a bit back. I'm really not trying to climb Maslow's Hierarchy, ourquest...

[Jamie Smith]

blow me down, my signature's back again for this and earlier posts, but i note many others are still missing??? Maybe just visiting my online profile and closing it again reset the display?

[Jamie Smith]

As for the job search people, there was a PC company that tried the same thing a few years earlier, selling assets and IP to another (self owned) company for peanuts and leaving the debts behind.

It got complicated, but I think the liquidator got the asset transfer unwound as being a negligent act by the directors for not getting proper market price by trying to sell it openly first, and then went after them for trading while insolvent. Further complicated by allegations of fraud, taking money knowing the business could not provide the product.

All these guys are doing is buying time while simultaneously selling their hard earned professional reputations down the drain.

[ourquest]

(1) Nothing was being withheld.

(2) The first problems I can understand as only about 5-10% of people ever try to write their own biz plans so many are not familiar with them.

(3) Same goes for using an agent or not, the person seeking answers will have to decide whether or not the forums posts are useful, given that they may be provided by someone with completely different needs and understanding.

(4) A truce? Moderation, moderation....

(5) I'm really not trying to climb Maslow's Hierarchy, ourquest...

Please note I've edited this quote and numbered each point to make my comments easier to follow. Hopefully my points are objective as intended.
(1) I think kanatakiwi's point was more related to your comment that you were not a migration agent; k just felt that you were too related in your industry and that most people reading the post would not realise your background and possible conflict of interest in your support of agents. But we all know now and I am sure everyone is all good with it.
(2) This does make me wonder if these other 90-95% of people should be trying their own business for the first time in a foreign country. There is a reason why NZIS like to see 2 years experience.
(3) Yes, everyone has final choice in what they use or don't use in terms of advice. And I guess ultimately NZ doesn't want people who are not forumwise enough to separate truth and opinion.
(4) Fair enough, a point I support and try to live by. But some passionate debating is really needed from time to time and the forum comes alive when it happens.
(5) You've got me here Jamie. At first I thought Maslow's Hierachy must be one of the lesser peaks in the Atlas mountains, but on reflection I remember with some help from Google that it is a sequence of assigning importance to life aspects depending on what is missing. What's missing for me is knowing what you meant by it, but at least it got a five point response from me...;)

[Jamie Smith]

OK; yes; OK; moderation; it's a reverse "what goes around comes around" - sometimes you have to perform random acts of kindness in order to receive them....

[Cynicoren]

Hi,
Sorry for the late response.
I have asked about my prospects in the past in this forum (working in NZ), but no one replied.
I have done the points test and it's quite a close call - 110.
One of the things I need guidance in, for example is to know : Should I wait until I have 2 years of exp. in my occupation as an investments advisor (not on the long or short term shortage list), or just get to NZ ASAP and try to get a job there ? Because if I do, maybe I can get some more points.
I don't know if I should go Skilled Migrant way , or "work for residencey" ?