[umutaydin]

hi everyone,

first of all thank you so much for taking your time and reading this appreciated..

Me and my g.friend, we are living in Turkey, im Turkish and She's a Kiwi we'll move to NZ next year.We' met in London but i moved out to Turkey and she moved here to Turkey after 1 year. Now we're making all the paperwork ready, u know all kinda documents that might help us to proof the relationship. But i still got some questions tho! I've got no idea where to start. ok here is the problem:

By the end of this year, probably Aug. our relationship will be on its first year. We've got proofs for the relationship like: 1- House contract, 2- joint Bank Account, 3- Lots of pictures, e-mails, mails, 4- Reference letters from our bank and from our work (as a public ref.) her resident Permit, 5- Lots of receipts, flight tickets etc... 6- Our joint Bank account statements...
So i reckon all these would be enough, or what you think shall we get some more?

The second thing is We're not sure that if we should apply through London branch or me getting a tourist visa and changing it to work permit in New Zealand, which one would be easier, what are the chances? i Know London cuz i lived there for 4 years its always a pain to get a visa there and can NZ London branch see my history in London, like my UK address, previous UK bank account, work place, taxes and etc or does it just belongs to U.K. immigration?
What i think is it'd be easier for me to get a visa from here and changing to work permit from there, cuz her family will be with us and it'll take shorter time by that time i2ll be there and know the place better...

OK i know im talking too much but one more thing: application forms... so far i read everything from the immigration website but still can not be sure.. when i get a spouse visa will they give you a Work permit, work visa, or a Resident Permit? and here are all the forms that i printed out: "application to Work in new Zealand" i reckon the code is: NZIS 1015, and " Medical & Chest X-Ray Certificate" code is: NZIS 1133 and " form For Partners Supporting Partnership-based temp. entry applications" code: INZ 1146

In one of the forms it says " have u undertaken military service in any country?" in Turkey its compulsory but im studying in the university so they delay the military service during ur studies.. do u think will it be a problem?

these all i've got so far. So what are your opinions? i really need some good advice cuz its all messed up and confused!

has anyone been in the same or similar situation before?

Thanks for all your time and patience...

cheers...

Umut.

[nickydwuk]

Welcome to the forum - sorry I can't help with any of your questions. Our application is quite straight forward. I am sure there willbe others who have been in a similar position who can help you though.

Good luck. :nice1

[umutaydin]

Thanks for the reply anyway, i hope ours will be the same as yours, quick and straight forward... ;)

Cheers..

[umutaydin]

does anyone have any idea, or any suggestion? We're stuck, and don't know what to do...

Cheers

[Nick88]

I think I understand most of what you are asking. With regards to the relationship proof, I have no experience of this and can only agree with what you have done in supplying as much as humanly possible.

You mentioned applying through London, is there not an NZ embassy in your country? NZIS in London cannot access you info on computer systems there, you have to supply that info in hard form (on paper), they just verify the info if necessary. That goes for the UK Immigration too, they cannot see your bank or tax statements unless you supply them.

Applying in NZ is a possibility but is a gamble, I don't know how they regard defacto relationships and whether or not there is a minimum time you need to be together before they will look upon it as stable and long term. You would need to get more opinions on that. It may be necessary to sit it out somewhere else until you have been together for the required time.

As for the military service, just say no. You haven't done any yet, the fact that you should have, but were at Uni is just detail. What degree are you reading?

[umutaydin]

thanks for the reply Nick88,

I reckon we're doing quite good for the relationship proof so far, cuz we even keep every single receipt and so, i have no doubt about that, we are trying to supply as much as we could as u said...

Yes i meant applying through London, cuz i know that all applications from Europe like Work Permit, Resident Permit applications has to go through London branch. Embassy in Turkey is just dealing with tourist, student visas...
So you say my application in NZIS London goes to UK immigration too... Do they see the application as well? Cuz I don't want any of my UK records to appear in NZIS in London branch...

Well if we apply in NZ we'll be on our 1st year of the relationship by the time we get there. And in the form it says: u must be in a stable relationship for 12 months or more to get a work permit.
Yes you're right if we cant get the permit or if they think 1 yr is not enough time period ( which i reckon 12 months is the required time ) they might ask us to live more longer in NZ for a while, and I'd stuck there as a tourist.. I have to get some more info about that...

For the military service i'm gonna say no cuz I haven't done it yet. I'm studying Business Management in the Open university. Open uni is like u dont have to go to school,just study from home or uni telly. so if they ask why i'm still not undertaken, i could say "cuz im studying in the open uni and i can keep studying from NZ as well" or could they ask me to do it first, That'd be big problem!!

thanks..

[JandM]

Proof of relationship.

Our son had been married to his kiwi wife for more than a year when they decided they were going to make their permanent home in NZ, and they'd been living together in the UK for several years before the wedding, but the authorities still asked for proof it wasn't just a marriage of convenience.

What happened in that case was that I wrote a letter with all our memories of first meeting V, our daughter-in-law, all the family things she'd taken part in, told about the wedding and the old friends and relatives who'd been there - like a load of gossip, really. And a family friend of ours, someone of our generation, wrote about her from his point of view. Then V's family did the same for our son. It's getting both families to say how they accept your partner as belonging in their group.

[thekiwibarkers]

Hi umutaydin!

I qualified for a visa through my partner who is a Kiwi so similar to you guys...

We had been together for 18 mths when we applied and it was on the basis that we could show that we had been together for at least a year and from the info you have stated it sounds like you've gathered exactly the same stuff as us in terms of house bills in both names, Xmas cards between us, photos on holiday, references from friends etc etc.. We also wrote up a page summary of our relationship ie: how we met etc.... (which was all a bit weird to do really!!)

We applied through the UK and the service was great so I would recommend you do the same as I think it's a lot easier than waiting until you are there. Also, I think it would be pretty straight forward for you to receive your visa as it's the same circumstance as myself..

We were worried that we may not be accepted as my partner (now my wife) left NZ when she was 2 and has no family there. It just happened that her English parents got a job in NZ and gave birth to her there.. However, the immigration officer in London told me it was a pretty straight forward case and I have now received my residence visa which is valid indefinitely as long as I stay in NZ and I also have a 2 year returning residents visa so if I leave the country within the first 2 years (ie holiday back to England or something like that) then I will be accepted back into the country. At the end of the 2 years I can then apply for another returning residents visa which would then normally also be an indefinite one so I can then come and go as I please. The thing is that we're moving to NZ to start a family and I would like our children to very much embrace NZ so I will be looking to apply for citizenship relatively quickly when we are there as if you are married to a Kiwi you can apply straight away....

I hope this helps??!!! ... Any questions then just PM me sometime and good luck!

[dharder]

The thing is that we're moving to NZ to start a family and I would like our children to very much embrace NZ so I will be looking to apply for citizenship relatively quickly when we are there as if you are married to a Kiwi you can apply straight away....

Really? Are you sure? There is no 5 year residency requirement? And it would make a difference in this case if you are married, and not in the visa application process? How odd.

I hadn't heard (not that I want to) that you can apply for citizenship straight away if you are married to a kiwi. Do you have a website somewhere?

Daniela

[thekiwibarkers]

doh!!

.. I'm such a douffous!... Just checked and cross referenced with the internet and books I have for our reference and the books I have that gave me that info must be pre 05 as I have now found that they have changed policies...!!

... I originally believed that it was 5 years but the books said differently so I'm glad you pointed that out!... Thank you!

Sorry!...

All this stuff can get confusing!!!!!:roll

[Asli&Mark]

Hello Umut
At last another Turkish person in the forum. Hurray I am not alone anymore :)
Well as far as I know that you cannot get a permanent residency till you complete the military service. However they might let you in with the condition of completing it later on.
We had to apply the permit from UK as we were living there so I believe you need to apply from Turkey, which also could be better for you as the correspondence wouldn't take as long for the translations. I cannot give any advice on the relationship part as my partner is English and we were already together and married for more than required period.

Let me know if there is anything I can help with

PS: Welcome to the forum :)

Asli & Mark

[Nick88]

So you say my application in NZIS London goes to UK immigration too... Do they see the application as well? Cuz I don't want any of my UK records to appear in NZIS in London branch...



No, mate, sorry we seem to have misunderstood eachother. I meant that no immigration dept has access to things like bank and tax records unless you send them copies. Not the NZIS or UK Immig. UK Immig won't have anything to do with this application. Anything like that from your last stay in the UK will not be on file with the UK Immig, they are not able to get those records. NZIS certainly will not have them, and cannot request them.

Asli, that is an interesting point about the military service. Do you have to do it before you are allowed to emigrate? Is that a rule imposed by Turkey or NZ?

[umutaydin]

Hi umutaydin!

I qualified for a visa through my partner who is a Kiwi so similar to you guys...

We had been together for 18 mths when we applied and it was on the basis that we could show that we had been together for at least a year and from the info you have stated it sounds like you've gathered exactly the same stuff as us in terms of house bills in both names, Xmas cards between us, photos on holiday, references from friends etc etc.. We also wrote up a page summary of our relationship ie: how we met etc.... (which was all a bit weird to do really!!)

We applied through the UK and the service was great so I would recommend you do the same as I think it's a lot easier than waiting until you are there. Also, I think it would be pretty straight forward for you to receive your visa as it's the same circumstance as myself..

We were worried that we may not be accepted as my partner (now my wife) left NZ when she was 2 and has no family there. It just happened that her English parents got a job in NZ and gave birth to her there.. However, the immigration officer in London told me it was a pretty straight forward case and I have now received my residence visa which is valid indefinitely as long as I stay in NZ and I also have a 2 year returning residents visa so if I leave the country within the first 2 years (ie holiday back to England or something like that) then I will be accepted back into the country. At the end of the 2 years I can then apply for another returning residents visa which would then normally also be an indefinite one so I can then come and go as I please. The thing is that we're moving to NZ to start a family and I would like our children to very much embrace NZ so I will be looking to apply for citizenship relatively quickly when we are there as if you are married to a Kiwi you can apply straight away....

I hope this helps??!!! ... Any questions then just PM me sometime and good luck!

Thank you soo much for the reply thekiwibarkers. I reckon we'll be fine by the time we apply for my visa, cuz we'll have been together for 12 months by that time. We keep everything, all the bills contract etc... Do you think we should write a summary as well, do u think it'll be helpful...?

I know applying through London would be more helpful than NZ. But they might ask me to finish my military service before getting there and won't give me the visa and that'll be a big problem, cuz that means i have to go away for 15 months. But if i get a tourist visa form here and change it to work permit in NZ that'll be easier cuz in NZ they can not send you back to Turkey just because of ur military service and i could just tell them that i'll do it later... Or i don't know will military service be a really problem, shall we e-mail the NZIS in NZ and ask about it to get more info?

Thank you soo much again for your help...


Hello Umut
At last another Turkish person in the forum. Hurray I am not alone anymore :)
Well as far as I know that you cannot get a permanent residency till you complete the military service. However they might let you in with the condition of completing it later on.
We had to apply the permit from UK as we were living there so I believe you need to apply from Turkey, which also could be better for you as the correspondence wouldn't take as long for the translations. I cannot give any advice on the relationship part as my partner is English and we were already together and married for more than required period.

Let me know if there is anything I can help with

PS: Welcome to the forum :)

Asli & Mark

Hey Asli,
thanks for the post
Are we the only Turks in here? any other Turkish?

Are you sure that i can not get a permanent residency unless i complete the military service. So do they give you a temporary one and a work permit? cuz if they give you a work permit that means i can pay to army and do it for 28 days... This military thing seems like its gonna be a big issue.i dont know maybe we should call and ask them if its gonna be a problem or will they give me a temporary work permit...
I can't apply through Turkey cuz in here they only deal with tourist and student visa. so it has to be through London or either NZ. I talked to this embassy Lady that day and she said "seems like u got more chance in applying in NZ" and she said i can change my tourist visa to a work visa.

thanks for the reply again...

cheers
Umut

[umutaydin]

No, mate, sorry we seem to have misunderstood eachother. I meant that no immigration dept has access to things like bank and tax records unless you send them copies. Not the NZIS or UK Immig. UK Immig won't have anything to do with this application. Anything like that from your last stay in the UK will not be on file with the UK Immig, they are not able to get those records. NZIS certainly will not have them, and cannot request them.

Asli, that is an interesting point about the military service. Do you have to do it before you are allowed to emigrate? Is that a rule imposed by Turkey or NZ?

Ok mate, now i got it! thank you soo much.. Do u also know where can i get more information about military service? shall call the immigration in NZ and ask them? The thing is i have a friend he lives with his girlfriend in Holland and he hasn't done the military service yet but they haven't asked him, Holland immigration just gave the 2 yr work permit and then hes got a 5 year one now. why NZ is so interested into my military service that much?

thanks guys

Umut

[Nick88]

I have no idea what the rules are on military service, sorry. I doubt the NZ govt are particularly interested either, the military is not much of a priority here.

I am curious about Asli's comment about not being able to leave. I suspect it is down to the Turkish govt having strict rules. Perhaps if you leave before doing it they will catch you next time you enter Turkey.

[umutaydin]

I have no idea what the rules are on military service, sorry. I doubt the NZ govt are particularly interested either, the military is not much of a priority here.

I am curious about Asli's comment about not being able to leave. I suspect it is down to the Turkish govt having strict rules. Perhaps if you leave before doing it they will catch you next time you enter Turkey.


thanks for the reply Nick88,

I e-mailed the NZIS for the military service, asked if it effects my application. Here is the reply:

Dear Umut,
Unfortunately, we are unable to guarantee your eligibility for a residence visa or permit before an application is made. We therefore advise all customers to please refer to our Self Assessment Guide for permanent residency to assess your eligibility for any of our residence categories. The Guide can be downloaded from the following link (pdf file):
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/NR/rdonlyres/4DAD508D-CC26-425A-A57B-D2AF557C8510/0/1003.pdf


Thank you for taking advantage of our Online Help facility.

Kind Regards,

So they want me to apply first and then we'll see what happens next... I reckon it won't cause a big problem.They'll probably first check our status if we're able to qualify. But still don't know which branch to apply! But if its still not a big priority in NZ why they've got that question in the form? Never seen it before...

For Asli's comment she means that u can not leave Turkey unless u're undertaken to military Service but mine has been delayed for 2 years cuz i'm studying so they can only see u status only if u're running away. That means i can Leave Turkey without any problem which i did it before several times for London. And once u have the work or residence permit in any other country you can delay the duty as long as u work and live there. That means they can not catch me when i get back to Turkey, as long as i have the delay and the permit.

I reckon the best thing is to apply when we go to NZ cuz i can get the tourist visa form here easily and once we get there i don't think that the immigration would just send me back because of my military Service. But if we apply from London the immigration just might reject the application..

What is your opinion?

Thanks again...

Cheers,
Umut

[Asli&Mark]

Hi you guys,

It seems like you are relying on my answer. I would like to say that ( Umut will already know) women do not go to military as a service. So I was not asked this question. However, I know for the fact that the problem is due to Turkish side. Of course open university would provide an excuse to get out of the country but as I said before I do not think they would give you permanent residency without the pass from Turkish Military as I want to remind you that NZ is going to require a full translation of the National ID and passport, which will state that you have not completed your service yet. If you were to leave the country and complete your service in 28 days and the payment that would be accepted but I thought it had some special conditions on that. Anyway I might ask couple friends from England about that if needed.
Mark suggests that you should apply for the visa from London as he says there would not be as many application process going in London, although there were so many here. As we know someone who was already here started their application over in London to go quicker. and apperently it took only couple of weeks to sort it out.
I know you are living in Turkey and have a Kiwi girlfriend so I am not the expert about your condition. For us it took quite a while them to have all the translations and the replies from the university.

By the way there are only two Turkish in the forum now as far as I know. I have already met some Turkish people in Chch and I have heard many in Wellington and Auckland. In either case hopefully when you arrive here when (if) you miss proper Turkish food you can always come and have dinner with us.

Also later in the process I can give some tips about bringing Turkish food and spice and information about MAF as well.

I hope that helped.

ps you can always send pm :)

Asli

[umutaydin]

hey Asli,

thanks for the reply, I know all the procedure about this military service. As long as you work in an any other country they give you the delay... I have a friend lives in Holland he also applied for immigration and he hasn't undertaken to military service yet. but Holland still gives him the permit and he delays his duty... I'll be pleased if you can ask your friends for some more information.

I think Mark is right we should apply as soon as possible through London without worrying about the military Service. Do you think that i should just say no i haven't undertaken yet cuz of my studies, or shall just not write i'm studying... (Jesus!! one more thing to worry) if they reject your applicatin do they stamp your passport that u've been rejected. If its rejected we can still go to NZ as me getting a tourist visa and change it to work permit, can we?

I'm sorry i'm being a nightmare i know, but this is gonna change our lives and my future for ever, which is soo important for me..

Thanks for the invite, i can assure you that i'll be missing Turkish food when i get there, so mum already giving some Turkish food lessons to my girlfriend so she can make some Borek, home stew and stuff... So u're also welcome to visit us for a Turkish feast!

thank you soo much again
Umut

[umutaydin]

Does anyone have any other idea or suggestion?

Cheers
Umut

[umutaydin]

ok here is the update:

We planned to apply for a tourist visa from here and to change and apply for a resident permit in NZ. (for more detail please read previous posts)

only thing that i wanna know is:
Can i change my tourist visa into resident visa/permit when we apply from NZ? i know that u can not change Limited purpose visa tho

Cheers
thanks

[Nick88]

No, you can't change a tourist visa into a residence visa. You can use the tourist visa to get into the country, and then you have to start the whole application process from scratch again after you arrive. So you would need to make sure you have all of the paperwork available before you arrive otherwise it could take alot longer, what with translations etc.