[Leccy-Lee]

Well its about time i got myself a police certificate sorted out (actually its probably a bit late but hmm!).

So i am looking at old topics and links, and googling and i come up the Met Police in London which someone said anyone can use. I then come up with my old local police in Sussex. And then i found a national link for people emmigrating with the Chief Association of Police?

So which one do i use to get myself a police certificate that NZIS will accept? I see pro's and con's for both:

-Sussex police... Cheaper and no photo nonsence, BUT 2months?
-ACPO... Expensive, more better cert, and fast reply, but want certified photos etc.

I am leaning towards the ACPO forms, but they want a certified photo of my likeness etc? Now even back in the UK i dont have anyone thats known me for more than 2 years that is on there list of professionals etc? And no even my doctor would have no idea who i am/was as i dont think i ever met them!

Heres the links to the forms i found:

http://www.sussex.police.uk/foi/data_protection3.asp
http://www.met.police.uk/information/faq.htm
http://www.acpo.police.uk/certificates.asp

Who did you use? Do i send form to my local police in sussex, or do i go with the newer ACPO thing? And if so how do i get a photo signed? Oh nothing is ever easy eh....

[zardell]

Hi Lee.

If you lived in Sussex, I would suggest that you download the form A221` (PNC) on this link

http://www.sussex.police.uk/foi/data_protection3.asp (http://www.sussex.police.uk/foi/data_protection3.asp)

Don't know if you will need to get NZ police checks too cos I can't remember if you have been in NZ for 12 months or more, but if you do you will need to apply to the Ministry of Justice - www.justice.gov.nz (http://www.justice.gov.nz) and use their form Priv/F1. There is no charge for this and they take about 20 days to reply.

Julie

xx

[KerryS]

You just need to get a subject access report - which is the link you have for Sussex police. It's the same price and the same duration (max of 40 days) for all police forces in England and Wales.
It's 10 quid and you don't need any photos.

You don't have to apply for police clearance in NZ, even if you have lived here for more than 12 months, as NZIS do this on your behalf if needed.

[Danni]

Hi
I have recently applied for a police certificate through my local District Police and they phoned me up to say that if I am wanting to emmigrate to New Zealand then it might be better to go through ACPO now.
It is a new pilot scheme and one of the countries is NZ. I think she said that it comes into action in April so it is better to go through ACPO just in case the other one becomes invalid.
Yes it is more expensive but the turnaround time is good.

Good Luck - I was just filling mine in and I am lucky that I work at a school and have friends that are teachers.
:yes

[Jennispink]

I've gone with the ACPO option as it seemed better for me time wise, I was in a similar situation of not knowing anyone for long enough, eventually dug up an old family friend who I haven't seen for donkeys but who was kind enough to oblige. Good excuse for a cuppa and a catch up actually:laugh

[IanW99]

Hi
I have recently applied for a police certificate through my local District Police and they phoned me up to say that if I am wanting to emmigrate to New Zealand then it might be better to go through ACPO now.
It is a new pilot scheme and one of the countries is NZ. I think she said that it comes into action in April so it is better to go through ACPO just in case the other one becomes invalid.
Yes it is more expensive but the turnaround time is good.

Good Luck - I was just filling mine in and I am lucky that I work at a school and have friends that are teachers.
:yes

Agreed, anyone needing police certificates for the UK should now go directly to the ACPO version.

NZIS have changed this on 22nd Jan:-
Specific procedure for United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Go to the Association of Chief Police Officers website www.acpo.police.uk and click the Police Certificates Button, at the bottom left of screen. The instructions for applying for the certificate are on the form.

Ian

[Leccy-Lee]

Ok. i preferred the look of the ACPO option myself,

BUT anyone know any way around the photo certification? I DO NOT know anybody (here or UK) that is on the list of approved professions?
I emailed ACPO and they said "there must be somebody, your doctor maybe, we cant complete the form without it!"

I am now stuck unable to apply for a police cert right now! :(

[IanW99]

Ok. i preferred the look of the ACPO option myself,

BUT anyone know any way around the photo certification? I DO NOT know anybody (here or UK) that is on the list of approved professions?
I emailed ACPO and they said "there must be somebody, your doctor maybe, we cant complete the form without it!"

I am now stuck unable to apply for a police cert right now! :(

Don't you just love the way that the UK work :no

You need to send them your passport which is accepted everywhere as a primary source of identification and you also need to send them some photographs which also must be certified.

Why they can't look in the passport and check that the image matches the photographs is a mystery to me.

It's also impressive that this is a new scheme specifically for immigration purposes but if you have already left the UK then is basically impossible to provide the required information - way to go!!!

Sorry Lee, can't be of any help really, just so glad that we have already gone through this process otherwise I really don't know how we would have done it either?

My only suggestion would be to check with NZIS to see if / when they will only accept the ACPO version and see if you can get the older subject access version before that time.

Ian

[Leccy-Lee]

Yes good idea, i shall ask them tomorrow.
Had an email back from ACPO help, saying "what people do you know as professionals, our list isnt exhaustive we can accommodate other trusted professions"

LOL wait to i tell her the only people that know me in UK for long enough are either bricklayers and builders or unemployed! :(

[Gemini]

What about an ex employer?

[Potato]

I can't believe they changed the police certificate scheme for the UK. And what's more, it's a pilot scheme, guaranteed to be riddled with errors.
So now instead of £10 it's £35.
I don't see how NZIS could not accept the old way- the readout from the police national computer stating that you have no convictions etc etc. How is that no longer good enough?!

Several issues with the whole thing:

ACRO require copies of your
passport and 2 recent utility bills, bank
statement, or other correspondence confirming
your address (NOT the original). The copies
will not be returned.

What if you've just moved abroad, and don't *have* any utility bills for your address. Sure, you could provide a tenancy agreement, but what else?

This person is someone other than yourself or a
family member who can confirm your identity and
has known you for a minimum of 2 years.

Again, extremely difficult to pull off if you've just moved to a new country. Essentially the only way to do it would be to take a passport photo of yourself digitally, email it home, ask someone to print it and hunt down someone who can sign it, then post it out to you!
As has been mentioned, what if you don't *know* any people on the list? And even if you do, what if you've not known them for 2 years?
I couldn't even get my doctor to do it, I haven't seen him in about 5 years.

It does have this statement:

If you are currently residing outside of the UK
and are having problems identifying anyone
from the above list, please contact ACRO at:

acro.policecertificates@acro.pnn.police.uk

Not sure how much they could help though.

This process reminds me of the requirements for a UK citizen to be registered to vote abroad. Somehow, your British passport is good enough to get into the country and satisfy NZIS, and may be full of blue stickers- yet if you want to vote you have to have a declaration signed by another UK citizen living in NZ who has known you for 1 year. Hello? If I've just moved here, how am I going to find someone like that? Why is holding the passport good enough for so many things, but suddenly it will not suffice?

Bureaucracy . Pfff.

[mike&stef]

Dear Lee,

Many thanks for this bit of info, I think you have just saved our bacon!

We'd been sat on our ITA for a couple of months waiting for medicals and other docs to arrive when we had a hideous dawning realization last night that our teenage daughter now needed a police certificate, with only 6 weeks till the ITA deadline and a possible 40 days for the cert I was in deep trouble with the OH.

Will be sending this off ASAP,

Many thanks Mike

[Leccy-Lee]

Well guys i am still no closer to solving this one!! And that email address potato mentioned above is the people who have been conversing with me, and to quote them in an email last night (so far 4 emails each way and 10days passed)

Sir we are have been trying to help you, but if as you claim you do not know anybody that meets the criteria required then there is little more we can do for you, it is the Embassies that state the requirement from us, and as such they insist on a suitably certified ID photo. As you claim you cannot provide this then we are unable to assist with a police certificate.

SO? This means i be leaving NZ in June without choice and wont ever be able to live here thanks to the usual idiotic bureaucracy of the bleeding UK..!!!!

PS: Any teachers / police officers etc. fancy lying for me? LOL :(

[IanW99]

Well guys i am still no closer to solving this one!! And that email address potato mentioned above is the people who have been conversing with me, and to quote them in an email last night (so far 4 emails each way and 10days passed)


SO? This means i be leaving NZ in June without choice and wont ever be able to live here thanks to the usual idiotic bureaucracy of the bleeding UK..!!!!

PS: Any teachers / police officers etc. fancy lying for me? LOL :(

Have you actually talked to NZIS about this yet i.e. if they are still prepared to accept the standard subject access form that they have been accepting for years?

Technically you don't have to provide a police certificate if you have tried and failed, instead you would need to provide a statutory declaration that you have tried and failed - which you have (and have proof of).

If it were me, I would talk to NZIS and state the problem and ask if the subject access will be acceptable and if not then how about if it was accompanied by a statutory declaration.

Alternatively, I guess you would need to extend your work permit for another year so that you have been in NZ for two years and thus know someone here who could certify the photograph for you.

Ian

[Leccy-Lee]

Thanks Ian, i telephone the NZIS people yesterday and the lady checked "UK" and said i need a "Association of Chief Police Certificate" which i am assuming of course is the ACPO. I am tomorrow going to try and apply for the subject-access from Sussex Police and at least i can try and wave that at NZIS when the time comes!

Amazing though isnt it, the damn red-tape that people come up with! /sigh

[IanW99]

Thanks Ian, i telephone the NZIS people yesterday and the lady checked "UK" and said i need a "Association of Chief Police Certificate" which i am assuming of course is the ACPO. I am tomorrow going to try and apply for the subject-access from Sussex Police and at least i can try and wave that at NZIS when the time comes!

Amazing though isnt it, the damn red-tape that people come up with! /sigh

It's interesting to note that the first thing that immigration now say for United Kingdon is "if you are unable to provide a police certificate you must provide a separate statutory declaration..." They must know something is wrong :confused:

If you are talking to NZIS or ACPO again, I have a question for them:-

"If you have lived for periods of twelve months or more in the UK during the last ten years then you must provide a police certificate" - this is the NZIS rule.

But, for the UK it is apparently impossible now to get a police certificate if you have lived in the UK for less than 2 years? So what do you do if you have lived in the UK between 1 and 2 years?

Sorry, not really helping you, but just shows how stupid the new rule is.

Ian

[Angela]

We have already sent away to Suffolk Constabulary for Subject Access ,Ihave already recieved achnoledgment of applications and reciepts stating that they will be with you in 40days nothing about any new police checks needed Will let you know what arrives to us as they are due to arrive within the next week angela

[IanW99]

We have already sent away to Suffolk Constabulary for Subject Access ,Ihave already recieved achnoledgment of applications and reciepts stating that they will be with you in 40days nothing about any new police checks needed Will let you know what arrives to us as they are due to arrive within the next week angela

If you asked for subject access then this is what you will get (hopefully), the police are unlikely to know why you want the form for.

If you want the new police certificate for immigration instead then you need to ask for it.

From other posters it would appear that the subject access is still acceptable until April, so would suggest you send in your application soon if possible.

Ian

[Potato]

Thanks Ian, i telephone the NZIS people yesterday and the lady checked "UK" and said i need a "Association of Chief Police Certificate" which i am assuming of course is the ACPO. I am tomorrow going to try and apply for the subject-access from Sussex Police and at least i can try and wave that at NZIS when the time comes!

Amazing though isnt it, the damn red-tape that people come up with! /sigh

When you get the standard cert from Sussex Police, I would also print out all emails you've had from the ACPO people- to prove that you have made reasonable effort to obtain the new certificate.
I would like to think this will work out well. You'll have a form stating that you have no convictions or charges brought against you, as stored on the British national police computer. You also will be able to prove that despite your best efforts, the ACPO system is just impractical (and near enough impossible) to navigate in your circumstances. I think things will look up when you have a person look at your case, as opposed to having to go through various policy statements and NZIS phone staff- who also can do little but read policy statements back at you.

[Leccy-Lee]

Thats a very good idea, thanks.

[mike&stef]

As Ian and Potato have posted you should have enough info: [from NZIS]

United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Procedures
If you are unable to provide a police certificate you must provide a separate statutory declaration in both English and your own language, detailing your attempts to obtain a police certificate and stating whether you and any accompanying family members have been found guilty or convicted of, or charged with offences against the law in that country, or have not been charged with any offences against the law of that country. This statutory declaration should also be corroborated by other information attesting to your character.

So as long as you're not an ex-con and maybe an employer could give you a character reference then you should have what you need !!

Regarding this April changeover, I can't find any reference to this on the NZIS website or on ACPO, just concerned as our police certificates are dated November 1st will expire end of April anyway [ie for use with ITA] and would need ACPO ones if they were going to become invalid during April.

Good luck with it Lee

Regards Mike

[IanW99]

As Ian and Potato have posted you should have enough info: [from NZIS]



So as long as you're not an ex-con and maybe an employer could give you a character reference then you should have what you need !!

Regarding this April changeover, I can't find any reference to this on the NZIS website or on ACPO, just concerned as our police certificates are dated November 1st will expire end of April anyway [ie for use with ITA] and would need ACPO ones if they were going to become invalid during April.

Good luck with it Lee

Regards Mike

I don't think that it has been confirmed how long the subject access version can still be used for, it was mentioned by another poster that they thought that they had been told it would be valid until April.

Clearly the website has been changed to state that you must get the ACPO version (as of 22nd Jan) so I would say that any subject access forms issued before this date will be OK.

Ian