[Graham Barnes]

Just had a thought which I'd like to bounce off all of you in NZ...might be opening a can of worms, but here goes...

Radio 5 this morning were talking about different UK football teams 'hating' each other...usually for no apparent reason except being either
a) fairly close to each other
b) one team being more successful than the other
c) one team buying another team's player, usually for stratospheric quantities of cash.
When supporters were questioned, their usual answer consisted of the usual logical reasoning you get from your average footballing 'fan'...
"Well, it's always been like this..."
"Well, we just do..." :?

Do NZ rugby teams have the same level of animosity, which in my eyes, goes way beyond healthy competitiveness. The Super-12 is a franchised tournament, and the games I've watched have always seemed a bit sterile. But far more family friendly, and fantastic entertainment.
But what about the local club derbies...Manukau v North Harbour, and the like??
If not, is there is the same level of passion, but without the yobbishness??

And I've read that football is becoming increasingly popular in NZ anyway. If this is truely the case, does it have the same unpleasant aspects as in the UK game?

Personally, I'm a BIG rugby fan (and still play), and I can't be doing with football....I've been to loads of UK Premiership games (rugby), and whilst everyone wants their team to win, there isn't anywhere near the same atmosphere of unattractive intimidation. Rugby keeps that sort of thing ON the pitch...and I'm willing to put up my hand to admit that I'm no angel at times!! But all done and dusted after the final whistle...none of the off-pitch stuff which just winds everyone up. Makes football more of a soap opera than a sport.

Apologies if I've just insulted the footballing section of the forum...!!

[Iain]

I'm an average football fan (Port Vale - our arch rivals are Stoke City). I've been to derby games with my mates - gone for a pint first, walked up to the stadium together, they've gone in the City end, I've gone in the Vale end. Probably done a few choruses of "You're sh*t and you know you are" etc etc, and after the game met up and gone for a pint afterwards. Same as 99.9% of fans.

There's a lot of banter at the games, but it's just that, banter. People who take it too seriously and go and thump each other afterwards are just thugs, who'd probably be thumping each other anyway, football or not.

Go to most Premiership games now and you'll see a lot of families enjoying the day out. People get ejected for swearing these days!! You say football is more of a soap opera than a sport - in some ways that's right, there's certainly a whole lot more about it than the 90 minutes spent on the pitch. Nothing wrong with that.

[Carol]

Iain I agree.
While we were home we went to see Newcastle play twice.
I couldnt quite get over how comfortable I felt being in St James' Park with my two kids. I didnt expect it at all given the "image" portrayed by the media.

The boys couldn't get over the passion.
They said they have never seen ANYTHING like it in New Zealand.


My husband and the boys also had the good fortune of being invited to watch kids (15-16 year olds) training at the Newcastle Youth Acadamy.

Kenny said after seeing those kids it hits home pretty hard just why New Zealand is never going to make it in any serious competition in football.

It may be gaining in popularity but it is still in embyo stage compared to the skill level of the UK.

So.... enjoy your rugby when you get here....personally - it leaves me icy cold.
Even the almighty All Blacks cant do it for me.
I've heard the "Sevens" is great to go to............but it has absolutely nowt to do with Rugby. It's the crowds you go to watch!

Carol

[Graham Barnes]

Mind you...

The 'almighty' All Blacks are quite so mighty as they once were. :yes
But then again, nor are England... :(

Each to his own.

[adamsat]

I've been to Premiership footballs games , but I haven't seen anything to compare to the atmosphere at Twickenham for an England Rugby international, and although footabll is a lot safer now, I still couldn't imagine opposing fans standing shoulder to shoulder as they do in rubgy.

Two places I really am going to miss when we go are Highbury and Twickenham. Still I imagine the atmosphere at an Allblacks vs Wallabies could go some way to make up for it.

Andy

PS Anyone know of a Christchurch Gunners supporters club?

[Beach Kiwi]

Rugby, league and soccer teams have no animosity towards each other, apart from the desire to win on the field, of course. Same goes for the supporters, although there are the occassional post match 'incidents' due to excess drinking.

In New Zealand it's still just a game, not a war. ;)

[Caven]

Iain I agree.
While we were home we went to see Newcastle play twice.
I couldnt quite get over how comfortable I felt being in St James' Park with my two kids. I didnt expect it at all given the "image" portrayed by the media.

The boys couldn't get over the passion.
They said they have never seen ANYTHING like it in New Zealand.


My husband and the boys also had the good fortune of being invited to watch kids (15-16 year olds) training at the Newcastle Youth Acadamy.

Good for you Carol! Been a season ticket holder at Newcastle and totally know where you're coming from...comparing anything at St. James though is a bit dodgy because if you catch an important game there is nowhere like it...Twickenham? Who said that? Don't make me laugh! :laugh

Football taking off at club level in NZ like it is here might be difficult due to most clubs over here ( and in Europe ) having scouts the world over, including NZ. One day there may be a half decent international side though...a bit like the All Blacks really...

" Light fuse and stand well back "

[Graham Barnes]

I thought this might stir things up a bit. Just to explain where I'm coming from...

Just from my own experiences...I've been to 9 football games this season...a real mix, from Premiership all the way down to poor old Shrewsbury Town.
Did I enjoy them? Definitely yes! :nice1 Without any doubt. As Carol said, the passion and energy can't be beaten by any rugby match I've been to. Twickenham in particular is about as soulless a stadium as you could ever imagine.

But would I take my son? :no No; the example set by the behaviour of the crowd and players is not one I would want him to emulate. In particular, the disrespect shown by the crowd and players to refereeing decisions, and that shown by the players to each other.
As an example...just look at the Rugby World Cup Final. England penalised off the park by the ref...only thing which kept the Aussies in it, but no arguing with decisions. God knows what would have happened in a footy game under the same situation. :eek

I referee both rugby and football as a school teacher, and it never ceases to amaze me how lads who play by the rules and accept decisions on the rugby field completely change into screaming banshees when playing football, something I attitribute to the whole culture surrounding the sport.

And I know plenty of people will mention rugby players knocking seven levels of **** out of each other, but it's the far more physical nature of the game...and from a long-time player, there is plenty of potential for serious carnage on the rugby field if players didn't look after each other.

Please note this is not me following the old 'class warfare' between rugby and football. I actually enjoy playing (and usually watching ) both (as goalie and No.8), but lack of co-ordination below the waist ( ;) ) made the decision for me years ago.

Anyway, signing off now. Bring it on!!

Graham

[Diny]

My brother, sister in law and their 2 young daughters are season ticket holders at Wolverhampton Wanderers (jeeze). They love the atmosphere and the feel of the game.

Personally, if I ever ruled the world football, rugby, cricket, tennis, netball, ice hockey, basketball, baseball ...... etc etc would instantly become illegal. I just can't tell you how bored the whole sport thing leaves me.

I know I'll never rule the world, and I know there's always going to be 'sport Billies' out there .......... so I'll shut up and put up.

Booooooooooo !!!!!!

Diny

[Gran]

Err- Rugby is football, what other kind is there??????

[adamsat]

A related question just sprung to mind - although perhaps I should post it in the cost of living forum :oops:

How much are tickets to top level sporting events in NZ?

having just been relieved of an obscene amount of money to take my little boy to what could be our last game at Highbury :wah this is a subject currently close to my hear (and wallet)

[Beach Kiwi]

Top level rugby game tickets tend to cost between $20 - $60 NZ, but can cost more depending on seat location and the teams playing. Don't know about other sports, but they probably cost less due to their lesser popularity.

[Soon2baKiwi]

Hey Graham - are you coming over to Landsdowne next weekend???? I am really looking forward to it (and that's a HUGE understatement). Not a chance of getting a ticket though :no I think it's going to be a great game. :hopeso

ABs and Australia are playing here in November, are they in the UK too?

[Graham Barnes]

'Fraid not. Just as well really, given England's chances...so I bet you're looking forward to it!! Ireland by 8-12, depending on whether D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are playing or not.
Mind you, I've had money on Ireland to win the 6 Nations since the New Year, so every cloud has a silver lining. :hopeso
Chance of getting a ticket for the match...nil!! Mind you, I've been to Dublin for an International weekend before, and the match itself seemed to be a 80-minute lull in the festivities. :nice1 Most people there seemed to be there for the craic (and the beer...) :cheers

We'll be playing Australia next Autumn (we play each other now every year for the Cook Cup); don't know about the ABs.

Re. ticket prices. We paid $30 NZD each for tickets to watch a Super-12 game in Christchurch last year...for excellent seats (front tier, half way line).
I think the Lions tickets will be a bit more than that... :(

[Carol]

Err- Rugby is football, what other kind is there??????

Rugby is Rugby.
Football is football gran.

One needs skill with the feet..........hence its name.
;) :nice1

[Caven]

Yes, and one needs true physical fitness to play football, as there is little opportunity to stop every two minutes for a big cuddle with the ball still in play, or to spend four minutes sorting out a line-out...

Ever seen a pro. football player with a whopping great gut? No.

OK, Mickey Quinn, Gazza and now Patrick Kleivert, but we're Newcastle Utd and we put faith in fat :laugh

[Timbo]

Carol. I think you are confusing football with soccer :angel
Rugby is THE original, and no mistake.
Funny how as a nation, we seem to invent lots of sporting games, but then lose the ability to play them.