[batgirl1001]

Is there a reason why Singaporeans are No.2 on the list of nationalities who has left NZ?

It seems like slightly more than 3 out of 10 Singaporeans who migrate there regret their choice and return back to Singapore I presume.

I am just curious as to why the high numbers because it doesn't inspire confidence in me. I have friends who chose Canada and Australia and most do not regret their choice at all. I chose NZ so hopefully I am the less than 70% who think that NZ is a wonderful place. :rolleyes:

If there are Singaporeans (or Kiwis who know some Singaporeans) who are out there thinking of leaving NZ, can you highlight to me what's the main reason for leaving NZ.

[migratory birds]

I can't tell you for sure, batgirl, but I imagine it would be for financial reasons.

Not to mention that Singapore is one of the most cosmopolitan countries in the world...and the richness that offers the community is certainly something I would miss (food, art, music, friendships, opportunities for kids to excel in school and extracurriculars, well settled for many, many centuries so there's that depth of spirit/sense of rootedness that comes with well-settled regions, etc).

[joewandy]

Because of the expensive housing and high living cost ? Not that it's much different in singapore anyway :p

Or perhaps they're all leaving the cold damp houses in NZ to return to their hot humid apartments in SG.

Where do you get the list from, I wonder?

[joewandy]

well settled for many, many centuries so there's that depth of spirit/sense of rootedness that comes with well-settled regions, etc).

You're referring to the countries surrounding Singapore. Both Malaysia and Indonesia have histories and cultures spanning hundreds of years, and a very well-established sense of rootedness within the people.

The modern Singapore entity as we know it now began its life from year 1800+ (even younger than New Zealand). After living here for 10 plus years, I find that there is still a degree of confusion among Singaporeans when it comes to their unique sense of identity as a nation.

[migratory birds]

You're referring to the countries surrounding Singapore. Both Malaysia and Indonesia have histories and cultures spanning hundreds of years, and a very well-established sense of rootedness within the people.

The modern Singapore entity as we know it now began its life from year 1800+ (even younger than New Zealand). After living here for 10 plus years, I find that there is still a degree of confusion among Singaporeans when it comes to their unique sense of identity as a nation.

You're right. I made the assumption about Singapore's architecture based on my travels in other Asian countries.

But would you agree that it is a very cosmopolitan/multicultural country that could draw Singaporeans back to Singapore b/c NZ doesn't have the degree of diversity?

Or that educational/academic opportunities/rigors are greater in Singapore than NZ?

[Kea]

It shouldn't be the food: we've found lots of chinese food courts where we can get Malaysian, varieties of chinese food, thai, indian etc. For about 8-10 NZ $. Even found a place that sells Masala Dosa. And the fish market in Auckland is pretty impressive if you like to cook.

Not sure if Singaporeans are as into food as Malaysians?

I've also had people say to me that 'NZ is not the place to get rich'. My experience of Singaporeans is that some are very entrepreneurial so this may be a factor. I haven't really been here long enough to judge this myself though and I have also read that NZ has lots of small businesses.



Julie

[KerryS]

I've also had people say to me that 'NZ is not the place to get rich'. My experience of Singaporeans is that some are very entrepreneurial so this may be a factor. I haven't really been here long enough to judge this myself though and I have also read that NZ has lots of small businesses.


Auckland was just named the most entrepreneurial city by the Global Entrepreneurship Monitor http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/survey-names-auckland-most-entrepreneurial-city-oecd-33951

My boss has recently moved back to NZ from living in Singapore for 10 years, and he's struggling with the cold, the poor housing, lack of choice for consumers and the schooling. He's already said that he'll be returning to Singapore once the project we're working on has concluded next year.

[Incognito]

Hi,

I'm not from Singapore, however I have lived here for a few years so have a small amount of insight (I stress small) :) Family is very important in most Asian countries including Singapore so I would expect that there is some pressure to return home as it is seen as a duty to care for your elders.

Singapore can be cheap but it depends on how you wish to live here...........it certainly is not as cheap as most people think especially when you consider the price of renting. It has increased considerably since we arrived, we are lucky as we got our place before things went crazy, but friends have had rents increase by 70-100%.

[batgirl1001]

But I would expect Singaporeans who migrate to NZ are those seeking a slower pace of life, better housing options, a less stressful work-life balance and all-round quality of living standard not found in Singapore.

It would be a wrong thing to compare apples with oranges and I am beginning to think Singaporeans are not as adaptable as they think they are. (Talking bad about my own people hah)

The stats are obtained from the New Zealand Immigration Guide and shows that mainly East Asians who migrate to NZ have a higher chance of moving back home after a few years in NZ. Top is Taiwanese where 49% go back after 3 years followed by Singaporeans at 34% and then Malaysians 31%.

So I suppose some of us cannot adapt to the life in NZ maybe due to a number of factors. Hopefully those Singaporeans who have left could enlighten me why they did so.

[KelvinAng]

I'm also quite curious about this, too.

I'd imagine the "slower pace of life" bites back with its extremely slowness compared to Singapore. It took me days to open my bank account, and weeks to receive my IRD (tax) number :D

[CJ22]

Okay, I'll be the one to drop the R-bomb then if nobody else is. Recently somebody posted a thread quoting some idiot on another site going on about 'Pommie' immigrants, and how bad they were. The thread was flooded with responses along the lines "never mind the Poms, it's the Asians you need to worry about!"

I was slightly taken aback, as I'd looked forward to being a part of the most widely disliked minority in New Zealand.

Now it looks like our friends from East Asia get to have that privilege. It's difficult to be sure from this distance, but I get the impression there's a lot of casual racism in New Zealand, especially outside Auckland, and that even within Auckland there is quite a lot of ghettoisation.

I'll be delighted to be wrong about all this, but that's my impression so far.

[batgirl1001]

I would consider FOOD the no. 1 reason for leaving NZ :yes

[KelvinAng]

Okay, I'll be the one to drop the R-bomb then if nobody else is. Recently somebody posted a thread quoting some idiot on another site going on about 'Pommie' immigrants, and how bad they were. The thread was flooded with responses along the lines "never mind the Poms, it's the Asians you need to worry about!"

I was slightly taken aback, as I'd looked forward to being a part of the most widely disliked minority in New Zealand.

Now it looks like our friends from East Asia get to have that privilege. It's difficult to be sure from this distance, but I get the impression there's a lot of casual racism in New Zealand, especially outside Auckland, and that even within Auckland there is quite a lot of ghettoisation.

I'll be delighted to be wrong about all this, but that's my impression so far.

Racism definitely exist, although I'm not sure if that's the reason Singaporeans leave NZ. Maybe it shouldn't be called "racism" but "nationalism"? Funny that the English are often singled out when many Kiwis are of English descent. The situation exist in Singapore with the Singaporean Chinese (who are of China Chinese descent) discriminating against the China Chinese...

It's not all that bad being English in New Zealand. I've heard that English tourists often get a discount when doing bungy jumps in NZ. No strings attached. Pardon the pun... :D

[CJ22]

Well I'm happy to hear that Kelvin, as I'd find it difficult not to speak out, which is a good way to get a reputation for being bolshy. I don't mind the anti-pomme stuff, that's just your basic little-nation syndrome in action, but proper racism shouldn't go uncommented on. For evil to thrive it is only necessary that good people do nothing and all that. I wouldn't like to be constantly railing against the parochial world-view of the inhabitants of my newly adopted country.

[joewandy]

The situation exist in Singapore with the Singaporean Chinese (who are of China Chinese descent) discriminating against the China Chinese...

I would hesitate to call that outright 'discrimination' -- a better way to say it would be 'mild resentment', which is probably due to migrants from China coming in droves to Singapore and taking away the low-end jobs from the locals.

And yeah, it's funny to see Chinese people being racist towards Chinese people :D

[fuhsiang]

Yup, I agree with Kelvin. It's happening here in Singapore even as we speak, the whole Chinese-people-being-racist-against-mainland-Chinese thing. Which is really quite weird. :)

I guess Singaporeans leaving NZ is a combination of all the reasons mentioned ... cosmopolitian city, choices, racism, slow pace of life and not to mention the food. Singaporeans are quite crazy about the food, to the point that there's even a makansutra somewhere ...

Personally for me, financial reasons will be the real nail in the coffin. After all, all of us have to make ends meet, don't we?

[joewandy]

Personally for me, financial reasons will be the real nail in the coffin. After all, all of us have to make ends meet, don't we?

speaking about financial matters, it's inevitable to compare new zealand with its close cousin australia (especially in regards of destination for people from singapore), so I'm wondering how much are the income disparities between nz & oz actually ?

this is the first figure I got from a quick google (http://www.hays.com.au/salary/pdfs08/Information%20Technology.pdf) (PDF!). I assume that most of us here are in IT, and I'd compare wellington and perth because they seem to be pretty similar to me (pardon my ignorance :p):



location programmer analyst programmer senior a/p architect devl. team leader devl. manager
wellington $54,000 $78,000 $88,000 $114,000 $$95,000 $115,000
perth $60,000 $75,000 $90,000 $110,000 $105,000 $125,000


of course this is a very simplistic comparison (haven't figured in different income taxes, living costs, etc), but it seems that nz's salary is only lesser than oz at the lower rung. As we move up the corporate ladder, the income disparities seem to diminish such that there's not much difference between the two countries (see development team leader & development manager).

i'd be glad if somebody who's actually in the industry could correct me in my assumptions :D

[CJ22]

I think that programmer bracket is way too low! You can do much better than that without trying too hard.

[Nick88]

You also need to take the currency exchange rate into account. You would need to add 20% to the Perth values to get a better indication, AU$0.80=NZ$1.0. This makes a big difference, especially when you consider the cost of living is very similar.

[Jalapenocheese]

I am not Singaporean but I am Asian (from the Philippines).

Before I came over to Singapore, I was based in New Plymouth for eight months. My contract then was until August 2007 but sadly I didn't finish it.

My reason was: New Plymouth wasn't the city for me. I mean, it's a great place for raising kids, good schools, my job was fantastic, and people were nice. But coming from a crazy city (Manila), I found it too quiet for me, especially at that time I was single. There was nothing to do after work (malls were closed) and no one to hang out with (no friends, :wah).

Which is why I looked for a job in Singapore.

But what do you know, in November I will be back in NZ, but this time together with my husband (and our cat).

Because I work in the health field, I find that my profession in NZ is so much better when compared here in Singapore. Doctors treat our profession with much respect, unlike here, which is why I'm happy to return.

And living in Wellington should be heaps better than in New Plymouth! :P

[batgirl1001]

I wonder about Singaporeans who leave for NZ. Do you feel an identity crisis in the sense.....because usually people tend be conscious of their identity when they are in someplace new.

Maybe Singaporeans who left for NZ and return didn't quite fit in being a minority in a country, made to fend for themselves sink or swim. In Singapore, the government usually takes care of us very well to the point of being a nanny state....but in NZ to each his own to survive.

[KelvinAng]

I'm not in agreement that Singapore takes care of her citizen. I wouldn't be in New Zealand if I felt that she did :D

Singapore is pretty cosmopolitan. About half the people I worked with are not native Singaporeans. However they adapt very well to the Singapore culture and I don't feel like I'm not around Singaporeans. It's all about the immigrant's mindset, I suppose.

[batgirl1001]

We are not called a nanny state for nothing and Singaporeans are known to always complain to the government who works hard to try and accommodate their needs and wishes of its people.


Perhaps you didn't get the slew of freebies from the government like money, tax rebates, subsidies etc. which can sometimes be specifically targetted for certain groups.

Nevertheless I believe that those who left probably found NZ the less than ideal society than they presume with the difficulties to adjusting to new things/ slower pace of life in NZ.

[Spooky]

Oooh, a 'Singapore' thread! :laugh How could I have missed it?

I honestly don't see myself declaring that I will stay in NZ all my life or retire there until I've actually experienced living there for a few years.

If I do decide to leave NZ, I suspect it's probably going to be because of the lack of job opportunities or career development opportunities. I think Singaporeans (by and large) are very driven by work, and it's not just because of materialistic reasons, but also the sense of achievement and professional growth that come with the job. Yes we do love our work and what worries me most about coming to NZ is finding a job that can keep me challenged and growing. I don't want to work just to pay the bills.

I hear (disclaimer - this is just hearsay) that it's hard for Asians to really get good management or leadership positions in NZ. I have scoured the staff sections of university, polytechnic and college websites, and so far I have only seen one Asian listed there, and she's not holding any management post. I am not sure if I could survive long in an environment where I can't go higher or further (again, I stress that it's not just about blind materialistic ambition).

So I ask myself if getting a slower pace of life equates with a slower career path? Must they be mutually exclusive? Can I have my cake and eat it as well?

I'll be happy to hear from others whether my apprehensions are well-founded or mere speculation. :)

[KelvinAng]

We are not called a nanny state for nothing and Singaporeans are known to always complain to the government who works hard to try and accommodate their needs and wishes of its people.

I must have been living in a very different Singapore, from the looks of it! :D

[KelvinAng]

If I do decide to leave NZ, I suspect it's probably going to be because of the lack of job opportunities or career development opportunities. I think Singaporeans (by and large) are very driven by work, and it's not just because of materialistic reasons, but also the sense of achievement and professional growth that come with the job. Yes we do love our work and what worries me most about coming to NZ is finding a job that can keep me challenged and growing. I don't want to work just to pay the bills.

Oooooohh, a true blue Singaporean! What line of work do you do?

I'm in I.T. and I find my job here comparable to Singapore in terms of levels of excitement and job satisfaction. I'm more or less a one-man I.T. department in both places so it always keep me entertained.

That said, I love the time I have when I'm not working! A stroll by the quiet beach, a motorbike ride along the country roads (and a crash... but that's another story), the ability to "get out there" over the weekends. This sense of space is one of the reasons that brought me to NZ.

If I decide to leave NZ someday, it'll probably be missing relatives, friends or food :yes

[Moorf]

and a crash... but that's another story It's a good story, though!! :D

[Spooky]

I would love to try to live a life where after work, I take long walks and just chill, instead of checking my email. You could say that's possible in Singapore too, and that it's all a matter of choice, but often the work culture does turn you into a workaholic zombie, without you even realising (not realizing - see another thread :D) it. One never knows - I might actually like it and not crave for a fast-track career :p.

I'm in education/ training/ academia by the way. Darn, maybe I should have done IT or engineering. :nice1

[KelvinAng]

I would love to try to live a life where after work, I take long walks and just chill, instead of checking my email. You could say that's possible in Singapore too, and that it's all a matter of choice, but often the work culture does turn you into a workaholic zombie, without you even realising (not realizing - see another thread :D) it. One never knows - I might actually like it and not crave for a fast-track career :p.

I'm in education/ training/ academia by the way. Darn, maybe I should have done IT or engineering. :nice1

I never like to walk about as much in Singapore as in New Zealand. Just about the only times I go out for a walk would be midnight (it's true!). It's a lot cooler, quieter, less noise, and the air felt fresher. Singapore wonderful in that it's perfectly safe to take midnight walks and not bumping into semi-drunken teenagers hurling insensitive comments at you. I used to work as a freelance web developer from home in Singapore and found that's the perfect time for my "screen break". Otherwise I tend to hide indoors.

Tough being in the education sector I reckon. I.T. is the easier option :D

[StevieD]

Climate :laugh

[Spooky]

Climate :laugh

Hmmm...hot, sticky, rainy Singapore vs. cool, wet, dampy NZ....?? I wonder...:laugh

[batgirl1001]

Ya-lah KelvinAng, I think you DID grow up in a different Singapore from me being single and having a freelance job and all that.

As I pointed out only certain segments of Singapore get or are entitled for benefits and other freebies. Being single is a disadvantage in Singapore because the government doesn't really think about you. :uhoh

Being married with housing assets, family and kids is probably the best group to be in since there is a slew of benefits all aimed at us. Furthermore I think the government is also trying to push us to have more and more kids since they threw in quite a lot of stuff at us all in the name or raising our paltry 1.29 birth rate.

So perhaps NZ is the right place for you. I have friends in Melbourne who have migrated there, bought a house and intend to raise a family there because they find life in Melbourne to be the ideal. They incidently wrote to ST Forum who published their letter on why they moved from Singapore to Melbourne. One of them is seriously thinking of renoucing his citizenship which is no small move in fact.

---Jalapenocheese: I agree with you that Singaporeans/Singapore doesn't seem to view nursing with a lot of respect. I have 2 aunts and both are veteran nurses with a lot of experience. Although they are highly trained and paid very well, people/patients somehow may look down on nurses and the profession at large.

However in the last few years nursing has begun to get a better reputation as more and more locals are joining the profession so perhaps in a couple of years more, we might see a significant attitude change in perception of the profession at large.

[batgirl1001]

Incidently KelvinAng, did you encounter any instances of racism in NZ? I've been reading the postings of some forum members who have very interesting things to say about racism in general including beanbeanz and they seem to view racism as rearing its ugly head in NZ as well.

[KelvinAng]

I don't wish to get into a discussion here on Singapore politics. It's best that I keep my opinions of the governmental policies to myself as well lest I be deemed an undesirable and get detained indefinitely without trial under the Internal Securities Act when I return to Singapore for a visit :laugh

The political scene here in NZ is also not as transparent as it should be, but at least there's clean air, fresh water, lots of land and a (mostly) gracious society to keep me distracted.

Do you intend to or have you submitted your EOI? When it's time for you to obtain the Singapore police certificate before ITA submission, that little exit survey/questionnaire form that you must complete presents some interesting questions. Singapore knows the reason Singaporeans are leaving but have done nothing about it. I "quit" (to phrase a former Prime Minister of Singapore) without guilt.

Giving up your Singapore citizenship is the only way you can have access to part of your compulsory savings with the government under the CPF scheme. Depending on your CPF balances it may well be a logical thing to do especially if you are certain that you wish to settle down elsewhere and can better make use of your money.

I feel that racism is pretty much a global issue. People tend to fear the unknown and are resistant to change. My personal experience with "racism" towards me in NZ are limited to my trip here as a tourist in 2006. In the month that I was here, while touring the South Island, I had two or three cases of teenagers calling me names and pointing a finger at me. Since being here in March 2008 I've not had any similar encounters. Rather, I had countless cases of strangers smiling and saying "hello" in the streets (especially in Sumner).

That said, every now and then you'll read about hate crimes in the papers, such as people stabbing others for "talking funny". It's all a part of a very real world that Singaporeans have been sheltered from by the very strict governance of the country.

It's the choice between the blue pill or the red :D

[batgirl1001]

Relax KA, not to worry. No one who criticises govt policies gets time in ISA. That was the old way of thinking...somewhat outdated 90s.Otherwise 99% of us Singaporeans would be held accountable without trial:). Nowadays the rules are more relax but the no-nos are still no attacks on religion and race.

You can be jailed, fine or both for such attacks but not detained under ISA. You are only detained under ISA if you are deemed to be a grave political and security risk....which I am sure you are not unless you happen to be a closet terrorist:D

I should know, I used to work for the ministry where ISD is one of the departments under.

As is, I am on my way to Auckland. Got residency already and will move May 2009. Hence making preliminary plans already including scoping about the places to stay/job offers/ schools etc.

As for the racism issue, you seem to be lucky because some others have racist experiences while in NZ if you read the threads. While I was living for 2 years in Brisbane, I never encountered a racist experience, which puts me in the lucky category but not some of my friends. Hence that is perhaps why I still love Brisbane after all this time.

I am very sure my friend in Melbourne is not giving up citizenship to get CPF but rather as a means to be more "Ozzie" I suppose since he and his wife feel more attached to the country than Singapore. Giving up Singapore citizenship is not an easy feat and it seems that the rules on renouncing Singapore citizenship is not so clear. And furthermore doing something like that might bite you back in the as#.

I wrote in this forum about a friend who left Wellington after working here for 3+ years because she felt there was a glass ceiling on her promotional prospects in her workplace. She already got permanent residency and the IRRV thingy but is still comtemplating about giving that all up. Something else about NZ doesn't agree with her though I don't think it is the racism issue.

[Spooky]

I am very sure my friend in Melbourne is not giving up citizenship to get CPF but rather as a means to be more "Ozzie" I suppose since he and his wife feel more attached to the country than Singapore. Giving up Singapore citizenship is not an easy feat and it seems that the rules on renouncing Singapore citizenship is not so clear. And furthermore doing something like that might bite you back in the as#.


Yeah, I think giving up citizenship is a different ball game altogether. I would never want to give up citizenship just because I can draw out my CPF funds. That would seem so petty. It would have to be for more convincing reasons like wanting to settle down in a place like NZ.

A friend of mine who migrated to US shared that it takes forever to get your money anyway :p (took her 6 months at least).

[joewandy]

It would have to be for more convincing reasons like wanting to settle down in a place like NZ.

Too bad Singapore doesn't permit dual citizenship ...

[batgirl1001]

Yep Joewandy, dual citizenship is like a topic where the Singapore government prefers the turtle approach where you just hide and don't discuss about it. The issue has been brought up many times before and it is always a NO.

For me, I prefer dual citizenship but I think I am biased since I plan to have PRship anyway.

The govt fear Singaporeans will use their dual status to forgo their obligation for NS. I don't blame them, intuitively I think Singaporeans who not rather serve NS if they could get away with it. Look at the example of South Korea where quite a few have dual citizenships especially US citizenship and many choose to run to the US to escape their military service.

So I think I will be stuck with a Singapore citizenship and a PRship for now and see how that goes.

Singaporeans really agonise about whether to give up their citizenship or not. There are some who choose to go anonymously, having 2 citizenships but not informing the Singapore government about it else they will be forced to renounce either one. In those cases, they risk the penalty of jail and fine.

[Leo]

Hello Everyone!

Being in my infancy on this forum, I read this thread with some consternation as it surfaces some of my concerns.

I've certainly heard of the "glass ceiling" effect and suffer no delusions as to the reality behind the proverbial "grass is greener on the other side". In seeking to truly understand what life is really like in New Zealand, I can sense that taxation and GST will mean my disposable income is likely to be low. Perhaps, I may digress with an enquiry on the employment opportunities available to someone who has made a career switch from Healthcare Management/Pharmaceutical Marketing & Sales to Auditing with degree qualifications in both & minimal experience in each?

The question of adaptability is pertinent though tempered to a large extent by an individual's expectations, experience (in both the country of origin & residence), personality & resilience. I suspect that the key lies in one's ability to assimilate into the new environment and more importantly; to maintain a healthy, sustainable balance when reality falls short of expectations.

Well, all this remains a theoretical exercise until one finally arrives & opts to stay the course, isn't it?

Being in this forum certainly helps me to narrow the expectations gap. Do keep sharing your invaluable insights & experiences! :nice1

[KelvinAng]

Welcome to the forum!

Sounds like you already know what to expect. What's left is actually coming here to experience it for yourself, mate.

"Do, or do not. There is no try." - some green dude with a glowing stick

[Spooky]

Yup, the pragmatic, practical and low-risk characteristics of typical Singaporeans present themselves as obvious obstacles to venturing into a new life far away. But I also think these same attributes work to our favour because, boy, do we do our research thoroughly! :D It does pay to be careful, a little sceptical and down-to-earth when planning for such a big move; however a sense of adventure and a thirst for trying something different (for once) will set you (and other Singaporeans on this forum) apart from the contented kiasu-kiasi* norm.

I say do your homework but keep that curiosity always afloat!

*a local dialect that literally translates into "scared to lose; scared to die" - atypical of an economic miracle whose social maturation is still playing catch-up.

[Leo]

Thanks KelvinAng, for your prompt reply. I see we're both fans of Master Yoda :laugh

I sometimes wonder if it's a Catch-22 situation... Not having an in-demand trade/profession, trying to secure employment ahead of arrival is tough (an understatement, perhaps?) without a PR/work permit but one can't get a work permit without first gaining employment, right? :confused:

I'll certainly be forced to dig deep into my reserves, opting to arrive first then struggle to gain employment as the clock ticks down all too quickly! It would be most helpful if you may provide an as-real-as-it-gets, man-on-the-street perspective of the current situation in your city and/or nation-wide.

How much do you reckon I'd need per month (on a no-frills budget) if I opted to hit the ground running in Christchurch/your city?

[veronica]

do the singapore bods who leave here go home, or is it just noted that they have left. could be some go to Australia.

[Spooky]

do the singapore bods who leave here go home, or is it just noted that they have left. could be some go to Australia.

We don't have the data on that, although there is now a strong movement to lure Singaporeans living abroad back. In fact our local station is running a TV series on Singaporeans living abroad (drama series, but based on anecdotes) and in a fortnight, the 'NZ experience' will be documented, so I'm looking forward to viewing that episode (with a sack of salt, though, given the propagandish overtones :)).

[Leo]

In fact our local station is running a TV series on Singaporeans living abroad (drama series, but based on anecdotes) and in a fortnight, the 'NZ experience' will be documented, so I'm looking forward to viewing that episode (with a sack of salt, though, given the propagandish overtones :)).

Hi Spooky!

Thank you for the heads-up on the impending episode... I now have sufficient time to prepare my barrel of salt! :laugh

Sometimes, I wonder how much (of the said episode) is based on real/objective facts garnered from returned Singaporeans? Surely, it can't simply be cobbled together from anecdotal experiences right?

[KelvinAng]

A rough gauge for Christchurch would be as follows (based on my experience only), all prices in NZD:

Single room rental, with bed and a desk - $90-120/wk
Power bill sharing - about $15-20/wk
Internet bill sharing - about $10-15/wk

Transport costs will vary greatly of course. In ChCh each bus ride typically cost $2.10 (if you get the MetroCard which works like Singapore's EZLink) or $2.50, I think, if you pay cash.

When renting a room be sure to read your tenancy agreement if any. Some would require you to sign an annual lease and some wants a "letting fee". Varies greatly.

If you prefer to stay in Auckland, the rent is typically $150-$180/wk.

http://www.trademe.co.nz <-- good place to start looking for a "flat" (a house rented out and shared by multiple tenants)





Thanks KelvinAng, for your prompt reply. I see we're both fans of Master Yoda :laugh

I sometimes wonder if it's a Catch-22 situation... Not having an in-demand trade/profession, trying to secure employment ahead of arrival is tough (an understatement, perhaps?) without a PR/work permit but one can't get a work permit without first gaining employment, right? :confused:

I'll certainly be forced to dig deep into my reserves, opting to arrive first then struggle to gain employment as the clock ticks down all too quickly! It would be most helpful if you may provide an as-real-as-it-gets, man-on-the-street perspective of the current situation in your city and/or nation-wide.

How much do you reckon I'd need per month (on a no-frills budget) if I opted to hit the ground running in Christchurch/your city?

[Spooky]

In fact our local station is running a TV series on Singaporeans living abroad (drama series, but based on anecdotes) and in a fortnight, the 'NZ experience' will be documented, so I'm looking forward to viewing that episode (with a sack of salt, though, given the propagandish overtones :)).

Ok, so the show was televised last night on our local station. It was a VERY SURREAL experience watching the 1-hour drama show from the series "A Sense of Home", showcasing homesick Singaporeans.

STORY
A Singaporean dude loves his secondment experience in Christchurch so much that he wants to stay on forever. He intends to spring this surprise on his ditszy wife and surly teenager when they come over for a holiday. Family is so upset that they end up on the edge of a cliff in the middle of nowhere (surrounded by sheep) and without gas. A Kiwi dude who looks like he stepped out of the B-grader "Wolf Creek" invites them over for a Barbie. Father decides to return home because he realises he was just "running away" from Singapore.

IMPRESSION OF NEW ZEALAND
For those who wasted their Sunday night watching this show, they would think that NZ was about three things: sheep, more sheep, and lots of sheep. Honestly, every camera panning or background scene had sheep grazing or bleating. That's if the bleating was not drowned out by the wife and daughter's incessant whining.

WARNING TO SINGAPOREANS INTENDING TO EMIGRATE
So the lessons from the show were:
1. There is no place like home.
2. If you emigrate you will be bored, lonely and homesick eventually, because see number 1.
3. If you want to emigrate, don't rush into it. Instead go on a holiday first because you might just realise that see number 1.

:wah:wah:wah I just wasted my Sunday night watching this crappy show!

[KelvinAng]

I better call home tonight to reassure my folks (it's an Asian thing) that I'm not writing web applications with sheep colleagues, for sheep customers and being paid in wool and milk. Like many Singaporeans they'll believe whatever they see on television! After all, the media wouldn't lie... right? :D

[joewandy]

this thread is still alive ? :laugh

[ykkee]

Would I see an orc in NZ?

[anothertrekker]

My reasons for leaving SG would be to run away from:
1. crowds
2. traffic
3. bad polluted air
4. hectic work schedules and no "life"

To start living
1. a sustainable lifestyle, eco house and all that (eventually, when I can get my own house)
2. quit my job (I'm a sucessful professional) and grow my own veggies, bake bread, make jam etc
3. run a B&B

My partner and I are not city people, we dont party, we hate orchard road, whatever local food we like - we can cook, stuff that we dont like, (e.g laksa, char kway teow) we dont bother....

[edmundt]

We went to NZ in Nov 2007 and came back to SG in Nov 2008. It was a 50-50 decision for us as there are definitely pull and push factors from both NZ and SG. Just to share on our considerations for staying, leaving and ... going back ??

NZ - Pull
- Fantastic friends & community in Palmy
- Great outdoors and gardens and space
- Somewhat good schooling for our 3 kids

NZ - Push
- Feeling of physical insecurity generally
- Feeling of frustration of the government and society
- Financially incomparable to SG though we manage to break even
- Can be a negative intro to SG people but will adapt in 2-3 years

SG - Pull
- Generally safe to venture out at any hour, for ourselves and kids
- General feeling that the govt is doing something right
- School is tough but it enjoys top-rate facilities

SG - Push
- Schooling in SG is definitely much tougher than NZ
- Tougher to relax and enjoy life, though it is definitely possible

NZ was definitely a great country to be in and that comment does not come from us. It came from most of my Kiwi friends who lamented about the good old days where crime was not that rampant, people respected one another more and kids were more disciplined. Most of them wish that things will get better in these respect.

There are many things to share but that's off the top of my mind now.