[Kanga]

We lived in Hawkes Bay for two years and I don't think we saw a single white tail. Then we lived in Oz and shared our garden with a few orb weavers (who made webs as large as me overnight and then took them down again the next day) and the odd huntsman, but had no 'incidents'.

Since arriving in the Waikato I've seen them all over. My house is fair riddled- I even found one crawling up my seat belt heading for my cleavage as I was driving the other day- my oldest daughter has been bitten by one (not here- in Hawkes Bay ironically) producing a large red area and small ulcer for a few days and I found the cat chasing one up the hall as we headed for bed last night.

So I'm thinking for the first time of getting our home sprayed. Anyone have any recommendations or advice? I'm a bit reluctant because it seems counter intuitive to spray the house with chemicals to make it safe :uhoh

Here's the rogue if you've not yet seen one:

http://www.kiwicare.co.nz/img/content/288/290/whitetail-s3.jpg

[NikT]

We had a lot of White tails when we first moved into this house on Napier Hill.:exit

I found that keeping the house clear of all spiders webs, inside and outside, has stopped them.
I read somewhere that they hunt & feed on other spiders.

We also have a robocan, and that might help keep em away.

Not seen one here for a while.:nice1

Nick.:cheers

[Georgebulldog]

We've had 2 both been bought in though from Taupo & our architect, well that's what I'm saying. A Robocan should do the trick though, ours has run low, OH saying there's a bit left so not turned the new one on & the spiders are out in force which could then bring in the white tailed if they are around here

[PaulaT]

This thread has just horrified me. I thought it was only Aus that had horrible horrible spiders (one of THE main reasons we chose NZ to emigrate to).

Please reassure me that horrible insects aren't the norm in NZ, otherwise I may have to reconsider the idea of moving....!

[dilanium]

Well there's a lot of interesting insects here. As far as I know the white tail is the only really poisonous one.

[IanW99]

Well there's a lot of interesting insects here. As far as I know the white tail is the only really poisonous one.

I thought that all spiders were poisonous?

From wikipedia...

They are known to bite humans and effects may include local pain, a red mark, local swelling and itchiness; very occasionally nausea, vomiting, malaise or headache may occur. Ulcers and necrosis have been attributed to the bites, but a scientific study by Isbister and Gray (2003) showed these were probably caused by something else, as the study of 130 white-tailed spider bites found no necrotic ulcers or confirmed infections.

Personally have more trouble with sandflys.

Ian

[newarrival]

We live in New Zealand now since 2005 and I have not once seen a white tail spider! And I hate spiders, so sure I would have discovered them!
For all those who have problems with those crawling insects- I guess the further south you are, the better......- no problems at all in Dunedin:D

[Sam B]

I've see a few, mainly indoors. I have just caught them and put them out. I'm with Ian, I'll keep white-tips and lose the pesky sand flies.

[mylesdw]

Well there's a lot of interesting insects here. As far as I know the white tail is the only really poisonous one.

In perspective, we're talking poisonous in about the same way as a bee or a wasp is poisonous.

[Chiba]

I've killed several white tails in our house - they're not really worth getting excited about, although saying that they do run pretty fast and they're good at going to ground, so you have raise your game. :D The last one I got was walking up the wall behind my computer display one night. When I poked at it with a rolled up newspaper it jumped onto the desk and ran straight at me. Eek!

I have far more dislike for sand flies and black flies and whatever else bites me regularly and leaves me itching; there just aren't that many white tails.

Have to say, there are some fantastic insects in NZ. I particularly like the huge variety of spider wasps - some are beautiful copper coloured things, like elegant little machines.

[Wooly_Cow]

White tails are poisonous as they use it for hunting other spiders. As Ian says there is no evidence that the ulcers and necrosis are linked to the bite itself. As has already been said the easiest and most environmentally friendly way to deal with them is to clear away all spiders webs inside and outside the house. Whitetails themselves do not make webs and hunt other spiders and bugs. Get rid of their food source and you will get rid of the whitetails.

I have found that whitetails are resistant to several types of bug spray.

[norma]

The katipo is the most venomous spider in NZ but it is rare and usually confined to coastal areas. It's related to the Australian red back and US black widow:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katipo


A version of the huntsman spider is also found around the Avondale area of Auckland. It's harmless but it could give you a bit of a turn if you see one - they're huge!

http://www.landcareresearch.co.nz/research/biosystematics/invertebrates/spiders/avondale.asp

[Kanga]

I've heard about the research RE white tails and I'm not a remotely neurotic person wrt my kids, but my daughter SAW the white tail, felt it bite her and she fairly quickly had an obvious red area that the next day looked pretty much like this with a larger, more ulcer-looking centre:

http://z.about.com/d/firstaid/1/0/U/6/-/-/474141915_56c6438fdd.jpg

She's not a fusser about spiders AT ALL and generally pretty tough but she cried from the bite she received and had an obviously sore arm for a day or so. Perhaps she's allergic to the bites then, but I doubt it as she's not allergic to anything else.

[Ana&Steve]

Our friend Sean got bit (caught and squished it after the deed) and got an ulcer-like bump, swelling and itching. He still has a scar 2+ years later. Maybe the only bits we hear of are the ones with reactions?

[Sam B]

I think that's a fairly normal reaction to a white-tip bite. They are meant to be painful and sore for quite a few days.

[Ana&Steve]

spider wasps - some are beautiful copper coloured things, like elegant little machines.ooo, they're steam-punk! :p

[Kim39]

Please reassure me that horrible insects aren't the norm in NZ, otherwise I may have to reconsider the idea of moving....!


You don't have to worry about the small insects its the big ones that are the problem, and they have a very strange name.........IMMIGRATION!!!


Kim

[JandM]

My grandchildren, aged 5 and 3, are being raised by their Kiwi mother in Titirangi. They don't see many white tails there, but she's made sure they recognize them. She's always dealt with them by removing them from the house in a glass covered with a paper, the same as I'd do with a wasp or bee in the UK, and these days, they do this for themselves.

Last week outdoors at kindy, my granddaughter found an Avondale spider the size of a teaplate, and took it indoors in her hand to show everybody. It seems the interested smiles were a bit glassy on the faces of SOME of the helpers :D, while they told her how interesting that was, and popped the leggy friend into a plastic tank to be safe till home time! Apparently, the thing about Avondales is their capability of squashing themselves flat, into spaces you would never believe anything could fit, so it's an even bigger shock when they appear. A friend of my son's drove off the road paying attention to one that walked out from between his windscreen and the dashboard, and the police told him this is a recognized regular cause of traffic accidents in the area.

[Ana&Steve]

Avondale spider, AKA Clock Spider
http://deepsquats.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/clockspider.jpg

[1979vanessa]

I feel sick just looking at those pictures of the Avondale! Nobody tells you about this when you decide to emigrate!!

[JandM]

But they're harmless to humans.

[TheNaylors]

HOLY MOLY! That's a beast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anything you can do to avoid getting these mammoths...and don't say "don't emigrate :D???

[TheNaylors]

But they're harmless to humans.

lol...I take it you're excluding what happens after I scream, fall over backwards, bang my head and end up in A&E after an encounter with one of those! :D

[JandM]

That's the human doing that, not the spider! (I know, I know, I grew up around a mother who freaked out at spiders. She says I used to say, 'Don't be frightened, Mummy,' as I took them out. My children aren't as bad as her, though not exactly keen, so I'm pleased to say my granddaughter doesn't take after her Dad in this. ;))

[macs gold]

You could move to the South Island. Amongst its many other attractions it has hardly any spiders of note. Certainly never seen or heard of whitetails.

[Jo Jo]

Oh my word - that HUGE spider! I love Landcare Research's description: The first reaction of most people on finding Avondale spiders is usually horror. The spiders move very fast when disturbed (as do people when frightened!)

[norma]

You could move to the South Island. Amongst its many other attractions it has hardly any spiders of note. Certainly never seen or heard of whitetails.

You might get fewer spiders but don't you trump North Island on the shark front? I certainly won't be swimming in the Foveaux Strait after the article I read on Great Whites in the New Zealand Geographic!;)

[IanW99]

You could move to the South Island. Amongst its many other attractions it has hardly any spiders of note. Certainly never seen or heard of whitetails.

Not according to Wiki...

The spiders have been introduced in New Zealand with Lampona murina residing in the North Island for over a hundred years while Lampona cylindrata has become widespread throughout the South Island since 1980.

Ian

[Arwen]

I LOVE spiders!!!

[Kim39]

:exit

I hate spiders!!!!

Kim

[nifta]

i have to say, it's only since reading this forum that i've even become aware that there are white tails in NZ! i never heard of them growing up (and i left NZ after finishing uni). i recall one time as a kid i got bitten by something on my foot and that was very painful - like a wasp sting... but that was it. i asked my mum about white tails recently and she's seen a couple over the years... she didn't sound at all bothered about them... this is in wellington, so may be worse elsewhere.

[Arwen]

Look at this BEAUTY. It's a Sheet Web Spider, pretty harmless.

It was on our porch.

One of the biggest I've seen here in NZ. Gorgeous. :clap

[JandM]

How big, Arwen?

[Arwen]

Well they say 'palm sized', (perhaps man-sized palm size)?? :D

Below is a link all about them. Do you like spiders J&M????

I have a passion for them because they eat little annoying 'flying things',:clap which I have a bit of an aversion too!!!

http://www.tepapa.govt.nz/ResearchAtTePapa/Research/NaturalEnvironment/InsectsSpidersAndSimilar/SpidersWeb/What/Pages/Sheetweb.aspx

[Kanga]

I like spiders.

I've found this thread useful and having had a good look around the exterior of this older (in Kiwi terms anyway) house I can see heaps of webs, so I guess that's probably making the situation worse!! I didn't know they fed off other spiders so I'll start with hoovering the outside of the house and see if numbers decline. Thanks all :)

[JandM]

I like spiders, too. Of course they can surprise you by moving suddenly, and I wouldn't want to get bitten by any of the poisonous-to-humans sort, any more than I go trying to get stung by bees or wasps or bitten by adders in the UK, so you need to be careful as appropriate. But they're fascinating, and the webs can be beautiful. (It's interesting that I'm like this, NOT having learnt spider-panic from my mother, as per my earlier post - one blow for the instinct versus upbringing argument!)

[macs gold]

Not according to Wiki...


Ian I'll stick to my statement - I've never seen nor heard or whitetails.

[IanW99]

I'll stick to my statement - I've never seen nor heard or whitetails.

Well you should at least update your statement as you have now clearly heard of whitetails :) :exit

Never seen one myself and I'm on the NI :yes

Ian

[Corbishleys]

You could move to the South Island. Amongst its many other attractions it has hardly any spiders of note. Certainly never seen or heard of whitetails.

Found a white tail crawling up our bedroom wall last night, in christchurch! wife not happy.
We have just moved in though, so i suppose it could have escaped from the removal van.

[bobo]

Found a white tail crawling up our bedroom wall last night, in christchurch! wife not happy.
We have just moved in though, so i suppose it could have escaped from the removal van.

We have had two or three in our Chch home, sorry they are quite common.

[James 1077]

My Mum and Dad left New Zealand before the white tail was introduced so they hadn't heard of it the first time I saw one. They are pretty harmless all-in-all (a light sting like that of a wasp) so I don't worry about them too much except to move them out of the house the few times I saw one. We had one in the car though (and an arachnophobic wife in the passenger seat) so I had to stop, pick it up, and put it on the side of the road (I like spiders so try not to kill them).

I LOVE Avondales though! Haven't seen one in NZ yet but they are brilliant spiders. When I lived in Oz I shared a house with three of them; one lived under the sofa, one under my bed and one somewhere else in the house (never did figure out where!). It was always amusing to see a stray cockroach enter the living room when we were watching tv and then see this huge beast run out from under the sofa and pounce on it! Unsurprisingly we didn't have too much of an issue with cockroaches and other insects in the house!

[Arwen]

I LOVE Avondales though! Haven't seen one in NZ yet but they are brilliant spiders. When I lived in Oz I shared a house with three of them; one lived under the sofa, one under my bed and one somewhere else in the house (never did figure out where!). It was always amusing to see a stray cockroach enter the living room when we were watching tv and then see this huge beast run out from under the sofa and pounce on it! Unsurprisingly we didn't have too much of an issue with cockroaches and other insects in the house!

James, that is SO cool!!! :nice1

[newarrival]

Creepy!:exit

[IanW99]

My Mum and Dad left New Zealand before the white tail was introduced so they hadn't heard of it the first time I saw one.
...


Well according to Wiki...

The spiders have been introduced in New Zealand with Lampona murina residing in the North Island for over a hundred years

So your Mum and Dad must be getting on a bit :exit

:D

Ian

[James 1077]

Must just not have been as prevalent or publicised back in the 80s then as they were very surprised that there was a poisonous spider that wasn't the katipo.

[macs gold]

or poisonous used to mean 'deadly' in common use of the language.

[lin]

as much as i would love to not freak out in the company of spiders, no sonner had I read this thread than I found one in my kitchen press & I jumped like a kangaroo! Ok, he wasn't big like that Avondale spider but he had white stripes & I don't need to know any more than that. I've re-homed him in the garden & I hope he stays out there!!!

My MIL told me about white-tails on my first trip to NZ. I believe they are common enough in Christchurch. MIL did get biten by one & did suffer a bit but no long term damage done.

Have to go hang the laundry out now & if I had wellies I'd be pulling them on to do it!! Haven't got used to all this grass under foot and the insects that go with it. :uhoh (can u tell I'm a city-girl?!:o)

[NikT]

...& if I had wellies I'd be pulling them on to do it!! (can u tell I'm a city-girl?!:o)

If you do get some wellies, be sure to check there's nothing lurking in them before you put em on! ;) :yes

Nick. :cheers

[lin]

If you do get some wellies, be sure to check there's nothing lurking in them before you put em on! ;) :yes


I did think of that when looking at my shoes earlier!!! hadn't seen a spider anywhere in the house until I read this post & came across 3 today!!!:wah

[Leo]

I like spiders, too. Of course they can surprise you by moving suddenly, and I wouldn't want to get bitten by any of the poisonous-to-humans sort... they're fascinating, and the webs can be beautiful.

I once read that spiders may bring one good luck only if left unharmed... Just wondering if any good forumers amongst us have interesting anecdote(s) to concur with this? :nice1

[Chiba]

"...money spiders (in the United Kingdom, Ireland and in Portugal, from the superstition that if such a spider is seen running on you, it has come to spin you new clothes, meaning financial good fortune)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linyphiidae

[Ana&Steve]

Can't believe in the luck thing, spiders in the house get squished. Exceptions are the attic spider (daddy long legs in the States) because they eat other bugs/spiders and they can't hurt us; and the one huntsman spider we found because they are rare here.
daddy long legs: (body is a bit bigger than a grain of rice)
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:5QLYcJ1XMieTAM:http://i.ehow.com/images/GlobalPhoto/Articles/4619970/spider_Full.jpg


Outside the only ones we kill are Black Widows.

[JandM]

But why would you want to kill a living thing that's not about to harm you?

[Ana&Steve]

Paranoia? :o Really, spiders freak me out. I wonder if it's a mild phobia as the sight of them, most especially black widows, makes me feel fear and revulsion. I try to fight it, as logically they are vital to a natural balance, but I don't share my house with them if I can help it. Also I hate waking up with spider bites!

[Scorpio]

Found this article on whether spiders are lucky; apparently it also depends on the time you see the spider. From young, spiders have had this curious habit of landing on me. Perhaps they know I am not afraid of them; many a times I've dangled baby ones on my finger like a yoyo with 8 legs!

Well, myth or otherwise; I'd like to think of myself as being very lucky indeed, eh Leo? :clap

http://www.luckymojo.com/spider.html


I once read that spiders may bring one good luck only if left unharmed... Just wondering if any good forumers amongst us have interesting anecdote(s) to concur with this? :nice1

[pukeko]

You could move to the South Island. Amongst its many other attractions it has hardly any spiders of note. Certainly never seen or heard of whitetails.

Not so I'm afraid. My parents live in Timaru and have removed at least one white tail from the house. I was surprised, I'd never heard of them before and I lived there 'til I was 25!

edited to fix typo :)

[Kanga]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2691/4337039540_45265a58b1_m.jpg

Here's one we caught in January. I released it far from home ...

[JandM]

It's probably climbing the front steps around now. :D :exit

[Kanga]

It's probably climbing the front steps around now. :D :exit

Haha- I drove round the block to disorientate it and I made sure there were several big roads between where I left it and my home and I gave it the full lecture about what would happen if I ever saw its little white behind again!

[Mamee & Co]

:laugh

Reminds me of living in the Highlands and the mouse incursion. We used humane mouse traps loaded with chocolate and cottage cheese! After the first time releasing the mouse in the garden when it made it into the hole in the wall of the house that I didn't know existed before I got back in the door, I used to let them out about 4 miles away on the drive to work in the morning. DH always used to sing "somewhere out there" as I set off :wah

Still think that they used to make it home before me though....

[moses]

I read this thread with a huge degree of horror at some of those revolting piccies of eight legged monsters but am surprised at people opinion of the white tail.
The issue with white tails is the venom and bacteria they carry CAN cause a reaction in people. This can be severe enough to lead to tissue necrosis and require treatment with IV anti-biotics. (See this link: http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/715522 and http://www.northernadvocate.co.nz/local/news/reported-rise-in-spider-bites/3908882/).
Im not posting this to scare but just to clarify that for an unfortunate number the bite is nasty. I know myself because I was bitten not long after moving over but had no idea of the consequences at the time.
If you do get bitten... call Healthline for advice.
My house is now sprayed regularly and Raid automist everywhere. And if I ever see an Avondale spider I am so outta here. Thats just mean having spiders grow that huge.

[JandM]

am surprised at people opinion of the white tail.I think it doesn't do to inflate fears of one particular species. The same thing used to happen periodically in the UK about adders, our one poisonous snake.

You are quoting two news articles here, each filling a page with the story of an unfortunate person's painful reaction. Of course I'm sorry for them, and for you, as you were hurt. But BOTH articles also quote experts saying that the whitetail's bite ITSELF is not a serious matter, though secondary infections can be, and there are rare people who get an allergic reaction. It's the same situation as with bees or wasps, and they don't generally make headlines. See the study mentioned here. http://www.mydr.com.au/allergy/white-tail-spider-bite-not-so-black

The medical message is the important thing to remember. With ANY bite or sting, if it happens in a country where there aren't highly toxic insects, spiders or snakes to beware of, whether anyone knows what caused it or not, keep an eye on the injury. A bit of pain, swelling or redness is just the body dealing with the situation - keep the place clean and don't scratch or rub it. Anything more than that should be seen by a doctor, promptly, because it shows something other than just the venom from the bite or sting has gone into action, and that 'something other' is what needs to be dealt with.

[NJ2NZ]

So for the mildly arachnophobics from NJ, NI & SI are out. But migrate to NZ we must. Off to Stewart Island then! (unless, of course an adverse report from Stewart Is. comes in in the mean time):D

[dilanium]

I think it doesn't do to inflate fears of one particular species.

I quite agree. One of my fellow students got bit recently, and we were all at a BBQ relaxing before classes start, and he was showing off his wound.

It had gotten a secondary infection and he had to go to the doctor where they used a little scoop to get out the pus (we were all sitting there raptured while listening to him rhapsodise about the quality and quantity of pus of course).

It was never a question of hatred or fear of the spider we just accept it aas it is, it's what it does. It won't kill you unless it gets infected and you DON'T go to the doctor (or you're highly allergic which is unlikely).

Just take care of the ones you find and if you do get bitten take care of it properly (which really goes for a bite from any creature).

[Chiba]

I'm still confused as to why anyone would release a White-tail. :confused:

[James 1077]

The issue with white tails is the venom and bacteria they carry CAN cause a reaction in people. This can be severe enough to lead to tissue necrosis and require treatment with IV anti-biotics. (See this link: http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/715522 and http://www.northernadvocate.co.nz/local/news/reported-rise-in-spider-bites/3908882/).


I understand that the necrosis is just an urban myth - the study linked to below didn't show any infection with white-tail bites.

http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/179_04_180803/isb10785_fm.html

I like white-tails and Avondales as they keep the house clean from other insects. But as we currently have a boy who is very interested in spiders I do make sure that I take anything that can bite outside now!

[Chiba]

I like white-tails ... as they keep the house clean from other insects.

Actually White-tails eat other spiders, so I can see zero reason for them to be in the house.

[JandM]

I'm still confused as to why anyone would release a White-tail. :confused:Speaking just for myself, I don't kill anything, on the grounds only of inconvenience to me, if I can possibly avoid it. I can't give something life, so I don't take it away lightly.

[Arwen]

Speaking just for myself, I don't kill anything, on the grounds only of inconvenience to me, if I can possibly avoid it. I can't give something life, so I don't take it away lightly.

Absolutley JandM. I stick to that principle too. :nice1

[James 1077]

Actually White-tails eat other spiders, so I can see zero reason for them to be in the house.

They don't spin webs and control the numbers of Daddy Long Legs so that they don't get out of control and you need to vacuum your ceilings once a week!

[Chiba]

Speaking just for myself, I don't kill anything, on the grounds only of inconvenience to me, if I can possibly avoid it. I can't give something life, so I don't take it away lightly.

Presumably you don't take antibiotics then? :D

[JandM]

Bit of a hair-split coming, but I think you know what I mean really ;) - I mainly apply what I said before to things that are visible to the naked eye.

Though actually, I don't take antibiotics or any other medicine without giving my body a darn good shot at sorting out whatever it is first.

[Kanga]

I didn't kill it because it wasn't likely to or trying to cause me any harm.

[Pigletguinea]

I am fairly disturbed by that big spider. Isn't the avondale the spider that was used in the movie Arachnophobia? I remember someone telling me that the hoardes of spiders in the moie were a NZ kind.... (*someone* being my kiwi husband who always thinks he's right) x

[James 1077]

Yes, Avondales were used in Arachnophobia. They are just the Kiwi name for the Aussie Huntsman. The Huntsman is protected in Australia as a native spider but, as it was introduced into NZ, there is no protection for it here so they were able to use it for the film!