[Carly]

Just curious if anyone out there emigrated to NZ without having been there first.

If there is anyone out there that did that, how did it go? how do you like it now? how was the transition?

thanks!

[clg]

We did not do it but we almost did it. We started the whole process to the point of submitting our ITA and paying fees without having been there. If we did not have ot sell our house we may have skipped the visit but that is a big enough move we wanted to go first even though we had not planned to. We just got back from a two week visit. That confirmed for us that we are doing the right thing. It also led to a job so it will be comforting to head out there with that in hand.

Good Luck!

Chris

[KD17]

Hello Carly

Welcome to the forum.

We are planning on moving there next spring (UK spring time) and we've never been in that area at all.

We have, however, lived in various other countries and have done lots of constructive research and are not afraid to look at the bad & the good sides of NZ, so we think we have a reasonable picture of what life will actually be like there.

We don't plan any visits before we go, and don't have any friends or relatives there, so it's going to be quite a leap of faith for us, but we're up for it.

Besides, we feel that visiting a place never gives you a true real life picture. You may get some familarity with an area, but with anywhere you go on "holiday" it's never quite the same when you live there.

Good luck

Keith & Debby

[ukiwibird]

Yes I did I had never even been on anything further than a day trip to France, I met and married my wife I was 20 she was 19 and from NZ when I finished my apprentice ship (grand old age 21) she convinced me to leave everything behind and go to NZ the year was 1980 I went to NZhouse and after a rather informal interview lasting 15 mins I had my PR(so easy then).
Feb 1980 and I said goodbye to every one and we flew to NZ with £300 (yes £300) between us with the help of Trudy's family we got jobs and a flat and lived the NZ experience, but after 11 months we missed England and flew back ,had kids blah blah blah!!
and now 25 years later we are off again but with a bit more savvy and a bit more money :mrgreen:
Will we stay this time who knows but doing it once makes you realise that its no real biggie if you get it wrong and if you come back life goes on , I hope to last more than 11 months this time I think 2 years is about right to get the feel of it ,

[wayne]

WHOOPS!! our computer was logged in as my wife when I submitted that post but it was me Wayne what wrote it :oops:

[jess]

Hi Wayne, you might want to read this topic on the forum:
http://www.emigratenz.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=17
Lots of folks comment on whether they visited first.

We just visited last month. Like Chris, we were already much of the way through, although we held off on actually sending the ITA back to London along with fees until we returned. (We actually just sent it off Tuesday. Whoohoo!! :yes )

If you can afford it, I would definitely suggest going for a visit. Though we still wanted to send in our final app., and though you really can't tell what it's going to be like to live somewhere just from a short visit, we were suprised and unprepared for how different New Zealand was from what we expected. Things like housing, which has been much discussed here, but which I really had to see to believe. So few people in NZ but so many houses are 10 feet (maybe 4 meters) apart form each other! I think if I'd shown up to live and seen that for the first time, it would have been a shock.

But we had time to look at some of the things we didn't like as well as where we live now, and some of the things we like much better (friendly people, pace of life, feeling much safer in Wellington than in our own, smaller, but high crime city). There are some other issues too that have more to do with qualitiy of life - as we view it - than with the tangible aspects.

Anyway, our short trip to New Zealand helped us make a decision I feel more comfortable about than I would otherwise have been. And I feel like I'll be better able to handle the NZIS interview. But hey, many people go without a visit and do just fine. Depends on how intrepid you are, I guess. :smile

Jessica

[zsj]

Well I had been to NZ twice before I think on famly hols and once on my own at age 18...that was many years ago and I am now married with 2 kids and believe me what I remembered about Wellington was minimal but the general memories that I had did prepare me a little for the move. My husband though had never been and he is settling quite well. I think the comment about holidays being different is a good one, if you experience something on holiday you expect to experience it when you live here but the living is so very different to the visiting. Perhaps better to go without pre-conceived ideas and no idea how it will be BUT a great big open mind.

Good luck.

Sarah.

[foolsgold99]

I did it. I've been here for 16 days now, I did think about a trip before hand, but it was just too expensive.

It seems to be going ok. I got house, job car all sorted out in the first 3 days(did a lot of prep work on the internet before hand) It's pretty much as I expected. If you've travelled a bit (states, europe whatever) you'll realise that the things that are the same, vastly outweigh the things that are different.

If you speak English, there are no language issues, my advice is to try and keep an open mind on things, and if you come across something strange, just take a step back, and try and work out the logic. Generally things are pretty sensible

[KerryS]

I didn't - but I came here originally on a WHV, which quickly became a work visa and then PR.

I guess if I hadn't liked it I wouldn't have stayed though...

[Moorf]

Had never been here before we emigrated, came here, loved it, got jobs, stayed.

:mrgreen:

[lindajax]

Us too!
never been just packed up and came and we love it too surpasses our expectations everyday!
Linda

[Carol]

We did it.
Brought our two boys - then 7 and 4 - now 15 and 13.


Doubt I would do something quite as reckless again to be honest!
:eek

We are here to stay though.... been through too much to throw the towel in now.
:nice1

[Diny]

Would like to add a different slant on this one.

Maybe .... too much info isn't such a good thing. I've been to NZ on numerous occasions and have travelled from Bluff to Cape Reinga and just about everywhere in between (not bragging before anybody jumps on me .... just stating a point).

The comment about living in a place being different to visiting it on holiday is spot on. First impressions count, you may visit a place that knocks your socks off while on holiday, but when you actually try to live there you may find it not to be what you want on an every day basis. This can happen in the reverse too.

I remember one year when we were in the Christchurch region I happened to fall into conversation with a person who has to be the most ignorant, rude, unfriendly prat of a man that it's ever been my misfortune to stumble across. That has kind of 'put me off' the whole south island idea. Stupid I know - but the experience is etched into my memory. However, just take a look at this forum to see how many members have gone to the south and are loving every moment of it.

Maybe there's something to be said about just heading off into the sunset without going there before. I take my hat off to all of you who have done it (or are about to do it). As for me .... I've done 17 years of visits and research and I'm still keeping a very open mind as to what lies ahead of us in 9 weeks time.

Good luck to us all.

Diny

[bbq]

Hi All

We are going to visit. My OH would not even consider the idea of selling up, shipping stuff etc. without a recce. Me... well I would, but thats a different story.

I am looking on it slightly differently, most who visit are visiting to see if they like it or feel they can settle in NZ. I am just thinking that my OH, is really seeing if there is any solid reason why she would NOT want to go.

Maybe I am talking complete drivel, but I thought I'd post it anyway

cheers

alex :P

[jonSE]

Reckless? Carol

Maybe maybe not, if you emigrate here with £300 to your name as Wayne (Kiwibird) did you have little to loose other than the cost of plane flight and the increased distance from family and friends. If you move lock stock and barrel as we did , it is probably £11k at worst. While this is a lot of money to throw away if it all goes wrong and the same to go back to the UK. It is possible to recover from it. Not that I would advocate moving in a big way unless you can afford to write off that sort of money.

I don't really think that the potential disadvantages of moving to NZ other than distance are really any different than say moving from london to cornwall. Both have a different racial mix, diff customs, different scenery, different atitude to life, yes Cornwall (or Wigan or Leeds or Leicester) is sufficiently different to London to be nearly as different as NZ.

From personal experience I would say that language barriers ignored moving to France or Spain or the US would be a bigger culture shock than moving to NZ.

I write this from the perspective of a country boy, who has lived in big cities since the age of 18 and is now working in Auckland (big city with a centre about the size of Wigan and a bit) but living on an Island (Waiheke so far behind that it's ahead).

Jobs and potential income in local value are a separate issue but you can research this on t'internet for NZ as easily as you can for the UK.

Would I go back to the UK

Well I miss reading biased newspaper commentary about politics - The ferry only sells one newspaper so I only have the NZ Herald view on NZ politics and I miss France.

Jon
Waiheke
Last week crime stats
15 yr old facing drink driving and careless driving charges
21 yr old - dangerous driving
40 yr old assault on a female and gbh and possesion of a cannabis pipe and perverting the course of justice (I think he did all this last week as well - if it wasn't him then lots of 40yr olds in the same place take it in turns)
21 yr old - insulting language
Oh and we all get interrogated as we get on the ferry every morning by 3 Agrisecurity officers and 10 policeman to ensure we haven't hidden alledgedly Foot and Mouth infected Cows or sheep in our briefcases.

[Carol]

Reckless? Carol

Maybe maybe not,


When I think back though Jon- we had no internet - no forum to hear our worries - no idea about value of wages - no idea we would be turned down for a mortgage (by the bank that employed my husband!!!!) - no idea that I was going to get approx only 3/4 of my UK salary because I had been trained "abroad".
In short - we were unprepared.
And it took me a long time to come to terms with some of the above.... worse was to come - I hadn't realised how much I would miss my loved ones back in the UK.

So.......no I wouldnt move again - for instance to Australia.
Not without a heck of a lot more research and definately a number of reccies!

[jonSE]

Hi Carol

too often the fingers don't always type exactly what the brain thinks especially after several glasses of Wiaheke's best Red.

I think you said it all really. Now you can do so much of the research without leaving the comfort of your armchair which was not possible even 10 years ago.


How much you would miss those left behind - can't research that on t'internet. To put a vague perspective on it I saw my parents three times in 2004, twice for short weekends at their home in the lake district, and for a couple of weeks in Perth WA just after xmas 2003/4 at my sisters. Yes it does concern me that I can't see them as "infrequently" as I did. If you see your folks every week or perhaps mum looks after your kids once a week, Yeah you have to think a hell of a lot more seriously about moving further away. But NZ is in that comparison effectively no further away than Wigan or Cornwall.

Thanks to t'internet it is possible to readily do so much more research now cf 10 years ago, that it is possible to work out what you will earn, what it costs to live, what a house will cost to buy or rent, what your commuting costs will be and how much and which bus route....

That said it really is down to those more personable issues such as what are the people like, why does everybody thank the bus driver ('cos when you are the only person on the bus the bus driver stops where you work rather than at the bus stop.)

Jon in Waiheke

[Carol]

Jon - it's amazing isnt it - we came here 9 years ago. And in some ways it seems like a lifetime.

Our lives have changed so much in that time - and a lot of change has been down to the internet for me personally.

When you try to think ahead - and what it could be like in another 10 years - the mind boggles doesnt it?
:yes

Makes you wonder what your kids are going to be doing for jobs.....I think it is safe to say that the technology hasnt been invented yet for the job my youngest (6) will be doing!
:eek

[wayne]

Now I have lived in NZ and visited it many times I actually think of Orewa as home :P and nothing gets me feeling all happy as when I drive from the airport to Auckland and see the skytower as I know we will soon be "home", but despite all this I have second thoughts and "what if" thoughts almost daily,like jon said I have more to lose this time as we will be going with alot more than £300 and its costing us 5-6k to get us and all our belongings out there, but today I had a meeting at work and it seems the area where I teach has been given 1 years notice that we may be closed down , so now I have a bit less to lose :mrgreen:

[Diny]

Oh our good friend the internet - where would we be without it?

When Mark and I first got married we lived in Darwin, Australia. I met him whilst I was backpacking (17 years ago) so being away from home wasn't anything particularly new to me.

However, leaving the UK on a one way ticket with naff all money and absolutely no idea when I'd return was one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Every Sunday evening I would sit and write to my mum & dad, give them the low down on the weeks events. If we'd been anywhere and taken photo's I would have to wait for them to be developed then send them home via snail mail. My mums letters would arrive every Thursday and I would race home from work to check the mail box. On the few occasions the letter was delayed I would cry for hours. All the news I got from home was at least a week out of date. In our first house we didn't have a telephone even !!!!!!! I would save up my dollar coins and then trundle off to the nearest phone box and have a snatched call with my folks every few weeks.

It was tough, but there was no other alternative. If I needed to speak to Mark while he was away I had to contact the Darwin Coast Guard and book a ship to shore radio call. I never did get the hang of those things, having to say 'over' after everything I said and knowing that every other ship, rig or sailing dingy in the Arafura Sea could hear us too.

But look at us now, the internet means you can send a letter home in seconds. Digital cameras man that pictures can be on the other side of the world in minutes. As for web cams .... what a brilliant idea. Cheaper phone calls these days too. Not to forget the text messages and the various instant messenger progs available to all. In fact.... when Mark is away now I can have a running conversation with him that can last for ages, I pass the PC, type a few words to him, within a few seconds the answer comes back ..... magic. (Unless of course he's out on the drill floor or his boss is standing by, then I can wait for ages for an answer).

I know that being so far away from my family will tear me to bits, but at least there's ways and means to get help cope with it.

It's all well and good talking about the good old days (which I do alot) .... but in some instances they were c**p !!!!!!!!!!! It's just that we didn't know it at the time.

Diny

[ukiwibird]

Hi all. Further to the posts on the 'world getting smaller' When Wayne and I first went out to NZ in 1980 we had to book a telephone line to phone back to the Uk. You had to say a bit then stop for a second or two to get the reply back otherwise you both ended up talking at the same time. It was very expensive and we could only afford it at christmas and birthdays.
Now, when our son is in NZ we can text or call him anytime on our mobile phone to his mobile, just for everyday conversations. He called us at 4 a.m. Uk time once to tell us he had found a car that he liked. (We weren't amused), he forgot about the time differance! :laugh Regards Trudy

[Carly]

We don't plan any visits before we go, and don't have any friends or relatives there, so it's going to be quite a leap of faith for us, but we're up for it.

Right on. This is pretty much what I’m considering doing as well. I do have friends that live there, but I don’t plan on moving to where they are. It’s so cool to hear from other people taking that leap.

How long until you go?



I got house, job car all sorted out in the first 3 days(did a lot of prep work on the internet before hand) It's pretty much as I expected.

Have any suggested links where you did your research? I’m in the very preliminary stages myself, and so I am looking for as much help as possible. I’m not even 100% that I’d qualify (yet).








Despite the cost of a visit being somewhat of an inhibitor, I agree that you don’t really get the full feeling of a place by just visiting. I think you get a much better feeling for life in a certain place by talking to those that live there – which is why I’m so glad I found this forum.

[Simon & Emily]

We are also planning to move wihout a visit. We now have our PR, and plan to be there within about 12 months. If we could afford it, it would be nice to go on holiday there, but to make it worthwhile it would need to be at least a couple of weeks, which when tied into school holidays and Simon's work would be an expensive exercise. We look on it that the money would be better spend on rent whilst Simon looks for a job!!

Every agency has said the same upbeat things about being able to get a job without too much trouble, but then they are paid to say that. However, nearer the time we plan to get our act together and make a real effort. That said, it would be nice just to have some time to relax over there and get used to the changes without time constraints. It will, hopefully, be a once in a lifetime chance (just depends on finances though :uhoh )

As people have said, the internet makes such a difference to all aspects of it, especially the planning and contact with familly afterwards. We plan to buy all three sets of parents the equipment for web cams and e-mails, so that they don't feel so left out of their grandchildrens lives.

All that said though, we still worry about the logistics of it all. Not that we may regret moving, but more the fact that we are giving up a great life here which we don't expect to reproduce on local wages. I'm sure it will be tough financially, but the lifestyle / stress levels will hopefully be worth it.

Emily

[Jo and Andy]

We are planning on going without a move, we planning a trip before we go for interviews, but thinking now of saving the money.

Feel the move will still be the right thing to do, a leap of faith, but cost and timing of all the traveling will be difficult, and Andy would have had to tell his work by then anyway.

See how things progress, but at the moment we are now planning on going on faith. The turnaround of 3.5 months helps me believe that it is the right thing, destiny.

[Mike & Nicola]

We havent been before, but then again, we plan on holidaying when we arrive for a few months, before settling back into that 9-5 routine...

Life's all about doing things for the first time ;)

Mike

[stevieboy]

We don't plan any visits before we go, and don't have any friends or relatives there, so it's going to be quite a leap of faith for us, but we're up for it.

Right on. This is pretty much what I’m considering doing as well. I do have friends that live there, but I don’t plan on moving to where they are. It’s so cool to hear from other people taking that leap.

How long until you go?.....

Spot on the same for us too. We land on the 8th July having never been further than a couple of trips to Europe.
Three Reasons:
1. Financial (it's very expensive when you don't have the money to do it)
2. To what end ? (you get a different view in holiday-mode to daily-life-mode)
3. Where's the fun in doing in that way, you only really find out by living life anyway ?

[ruthyroo]

We too made the leap without ever having visited - but TBH I don't know if it would have actually helped. I tried not to have too many expectations about NZ (and the ones I did have have been rather sorely crushed since arriving!), and we have come over on 3 yr WP and kept our UK property, rather than going for PR at that point.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing! Mr Rr and I agreed a wee while ago that if we'd known then what we know now, we would probably have found that a long holiday would have been enough of NZ for us - that way we could have have experienced all the good things without the crappy things. As it is, we're here now and are making the most of it.

At the end of the day, recce trip or not, it's a leap of faith at some level.

[Rimbo]

We'd never been either, just seen pictures on't Telly and T'internet. Looked nice too,
Sorry to steal a popular TV title.......
No going back! :P


John

[StevieD]

I think it's a matter of needs must for us t.b.h. Affordability is an issue, and to move we are going to have to sell up. Huge risk, yes, but if we don't do it we will probably become a statistic on some government website for failed business and home reposession! Some are quite happy to take the "leap of faith", happy to rely on others recommendations, ourselves included.
People have mentioned good and bad things about their move. and that is to be expected, after all life isn't going to be wonderful all the time. Yes, we will have to work, and do all of those unpleasant things like paying bills etc., but we have to do that wherever we are. And that is the difference between the pre-move visit, when you are in effect in holiday mode. Heavens, Florida even looks great when you are swept up in Disney mode. But read the papers and you see all that is bad beneath the glossy exterior. Look at the UK, my OH, Jan, works in Albert Dock in Liverpool. She mixes with tourists every day, and they all say how wonderful the uk is. But if they read the press and saw the evil that is going on around about them, they would maybe think again about what they were saying.
Having driven a taxi for the last 12 months as a stop gap measure since losing my engineering job, I have seen the best and the worst of people.
Drink and drugs are rife, and the worrying thing is that binging on both things is such an acceptable thing now, that I am afraid for my young children being exposed to this environment. Mollycoddling? I think not! I know NZ has problems, but on a scale compared to the uk? I'd love to see the figures.
No, if given the chance I'm going for it. Medical in 2 weeks then put the ITA into the mix and wait and see.
Sorry bout the long post :?

[Going2NZ]

I agree with a lot of what people have already said about costs of visiting on top of moving costs, the big "what ifs" that go through your mind at 3am, the OMG what are we doing? realization and a lot of other things.

But we're going to make the leap anyhow. We've done a great deal of research but ultimately it comes down to why not? My husband and I are in our early 40s, no kids (just dogs), have both lived overseas before and managed well and we want something better for quality of life. NZ seems to be a creative, friendly, eco-smart, beautiful, laid-back place to be.

From what I've read (forgive me if I'm wrong) but it seems that the biggest hurdle everyone has to get over is leaving the rest of their families behind (grandparents, parents, sibs, best friends, etc.). So maybe that is what is easier on us - James has no family except his mother (who is coming with us) and my family is spread out from coast-to-coast in the US. I love them but they just aren't part of our daily life. I can't see staying in a place we don't want to be and not taking a chance at building the life we want in the place we want just in case the family wants to stop by. Don't mean to sound harsh but I see my mother once a year usually and the rest every 2-3 years so I can't see putting our life on hold. Between email and digital phone lines, I'll be just as "close" in NZ as I am now. The friends are harder to leave in a way but most are planning a trip to NZ now and at least one couple is looking to move there in a couple of years when they can. I hope this perspective helps, it sure helps me to think it through again and reinforce what we've decided to do.

Susan

[Timbo]

:clap :clap :clap

[Stu]

Eco-smart Susan..... ummmmm..... :-) well, I dunno about that!

I mean to say, this is where we made the Agent Orange for Vietnam, eh! :-)
(ah, yes, good old 245T, bloody marvelous herbicide, we only ran out of it on the farm about 10 years ago, it was dynamite on the blackberry.)
However, for such a scattered clan, you may find moving here may just mean you see more of the family, not less, as now they will have a place to visit when they do an overseas trip... they may well stay a couple of weeks with you every few years, rather than just a snatched weekend every 2 years. Just a thought.

cheers, Stu.

[ErwinT]

Don't spend the rest of your life thinking "what if we would have moved to NZ when we still could?"

Just do it, and if it fails to work out for you, be proud of the fact that you have tried it and failed! Better than not trying it at all, right? :nice1

At least, that's my reason to go. Emigrating is quite scary to me, all the "what if"'s can be mind boggling sometimes (what if I can't find, or keep, a job, what if I won't be able to adapt enough to the different ways things are done over there, what if the interest rates (for houses) rise even more, what if we have to go back, then we threw a LOT of money down the toilet, etc tc etc),

It is an adventure in which you don't know in the slightest what you're getting yourself into, no matter how much you prepare yourself :laugh
To me, the whole experience of doing it, and getting a different perspective on life from within another country and people, would be worth the effort time and money put into it.

An if it all doesn't work out for me and I land in the gutter over there, at least it's a gutter with a nice view ;)

[Jo and Andy]

I keep thinking is it the right thing, I can't get my head around living in a different country, what will it be like.

But the what if factor comes in. We have our chance now, I would rather take it now and regret it. I think it will be great, if not give it a go for a bit longer and relook at the situation. I have too many what if's already, don't want another.

Am really looking forward (in a weired way) to getting there.

Good luck to all of us making the move

[Bubbles]

We have our chance now, I would rather take it now and regret it. I think it will be great, if not give it a go for a bit longer and relook at the situation. I have too many what if's already, don't want another.

Am really looking forward (in a weired way) to getting there.




Your thoughts echoe mine Jo

[Hannah-NL]

Going without a first visit/holiday too.
We're just a bit over our mid 40's. When I was 21 I went to visit my brother in Canada and considered how life would be when I went to live there. We have been thinking about living in another country for years now. 10 years ago hubby could even get a job in Edinburgh, but it didnt go through at that time. 7 years ago we were more seriously thinking about New Zealand and then my father in law got very ill, he passed away after almost 3 years. Our plans were put on hold until last year march, then it started to itch again and we decided to go for it, because our kids are 15 and 11 now, they might not want to come in a few more years! We're still young enough to make a decent living and buy a decent house and we think NZ will be what we have been dreaming about for years...

[Jo and Andy]

I keep thinking that someone wants us to go. Our application went through so quickly, we have put the house on the market and some first time buyers seem interested. They want to move quickly (bit to quick for me). So it must be my destiny.

I just can't get my head around the idea that I can't see my family when I want.

There is no way round that though.

To all of making the leap with or without a visit.

GOOD LUCK