[DLW]

Since the Perceptions to Reality Thread caused so much interest & lively debate!, I though a poll would be good on the subject to summarise.

What has surprised you the most? What has turned out to be your biggest misconception?

Money - You are worse off here
Housing - It's more expensive than you thought
Housing - No CH, DG was a surprise
Making friends has been easier
Making friends has been harder
Feeling of homesickness was stronger
Feeling of homesickness lasted longer
Weather is worse
Feeling that you don't belong

You can choose more than one or none

[dave k]

It was a good thread. Pity it was locked I thought, but then I think I must have a decidedly more robust sensibility than some forum members. It actually brought to mind an old Chinese parable which goes something along the lines of:

A monk was travelling between two villages & decided to rest for a while on the roadside. Whilst he sat there a traveller came his way. The monk asked him where he was going and the traveller replied "I'm heading for the next village along the road. The people in the last place were all idiots...tell me, what are the folk like in the next village?"

"Oh, I think you'll find they are all idiots too. But good luck" replied the monk.

He waited a while until another traveller came his way. The monk asked him where he was going and the traveller replied " I'm heading for the next village down the road. The villagers in the last place were so friendly & welcoming, I thought I'd explore more of this province. What are the folk like in the next village?"

"Oh, I think you'll find that they are just as friendly and hospitable too. Good luck!"

I think someone else pointed out on the thread that perception is reality, and opinions are to be used as a guide until you make your own mind up.

NZ is a great place. Is it right for you? Who knows...come & see!

p.s - had to vote Money btw...

[Miffy]

Never got a chance to contribute to the other thread. (great thread, surprised it was locked as I wasn't troubled with any of it ...)

Been in NZ for 6 months now my thoughts are:

surprised at how expensive day to day things are. I thought living in 'ripe off' britain things couldn't be worse. The "everyday luxurys" are no longer every day options.

Wine in pubs is more expenisve, reasonable from a supermarket but when drinking in London (city and west end) I was used to a large glass being about the same as a pint. Here it is almost double the price of a handle of beer.

Driving. I've found kiwis to be the most friendliest helpful people when you meet them on a one off chance, in the street, in the shops etc, but (big sweeping generalisations coming up - sorry) put them behind a wheel of a car and the seem to have a personaility change! Everyone single one of them is convienced they DO actually own the road and they won't give up their bit of space to let you in. Not different from anywhere else in the world, its just such a difference to their general mentality I sopose. The amount of people I see jumping amber or even red lights amazes me. As to the times I've got beebed at cos I didn't pull out into the tinist of spaces in the traffic. I like to have some sort of gap before I move not just a foot space between cars...

There is a lot of boy racers or 'hoons' here. main reason is you can drive from 15 and don't need car insurance. Big powerful cars are cheap, (japanse imports) so kids are driving around in imprezia turbos and evos, with not alot of driving experience behind them. And then there is amazement in the papers when these kids are speeding and wrap the car around a tree, with noone wearing seat belts no wonder so many tradgies occur.

Houses - although I read on here that houses didn't have central heating and numours kiwi friends also confirmed this, I didn't really believe it. :roll :laugh IT IS TRUE!!!!!!!!!!!! One house we looked at when we asked what heating did it have, the agent replied - the roof is insulated. wtf? insulation is not heating its part of the house, like a wall or a roof!
Luckily we rented a house that has loads of sun (its north facing, important for your house to get lots of natural sunlight) and a good wood burner. And we got wood delivered early in the autumn. Think I have toughened up now as I no longer have an 'indoor fleece' and can wear just a tee and cardy (and jeans) during the evening and at night the hot water bottle has been put back in the cupboard.
(my friend at work born and bred Dunedin girl has her electric blanket on all year round!)

Banks - with Avalon here. ALthough the face to face service is better, they charge for everything. My current account I get charged for putting money in, taking it out at the ATM, twice if I use another banks ATM. charged for transferring money from account to account, everything, they charge for everything. I had got so used to having my visa / debt card in the UK and carrying cash around, so now I'll have to carry more cash with (take it alot in one go)
EFTPOS is brill, you don't get charged and it is available everywhere, even in pubs not sure if thats a good or bad thing ....

I was shocked how strong the sun is. Having no ozone REALLY makes a difference. High factor 30 plus or stay in trousers and long sleaved shirts I think around noon time.

Generally people are as friendly or even more so than I imgained.

It really is an outdoors lifestyle. Every one has some sort of hobby, and at the weekend they are all at it. The shops are empty on a saturday as everyone is either playing a team sport (err rugby) or taking their kids to play, or doing their favourit sport (cycling, surfing, sailing, running, fishing, golf etc etc) then on saturday evening settle back and watch the rugby. Tickets are alot cheaper than preimer ship evelent so you can go to the match and take the whole faimily.

Meat and veg is yummy. Even if the high grade stuff is exported.
(PS I love the sauages over here ;) )

TV is good, all the US / UK trash programes are on regular tv so no need for sky.

Money in general is going as far as it did in the UK, but we are not wasting as much or frittering it away. I take a packed lunch to work where as I would get sandwiches out. so I'm saving there. We only have a take out or go out to dinner once every 2 weeks or so.
When we go out on our bikes we take munchies with out instead of poping into a pub for lunch on route. (mainly because there are no pubs mid route!)

Petrol although going up is still cheaper than the UK.

Tax. No council tax, no car tax hardly any tax on fuel. Basically you are taxed on your earnings and that is it.

Yes there really is alot of sheep in the south island (twice as many as people possibly even 3 times more)
Yes the sceneray is amazing even more so than you could possibly imgaine and its destered so you have these beautiful beaches / mountains to yourself.

On the whole the pros are better than the cons and life is very good. :nice1

[Miffy]

ooh that was a long post.

Not really a perception as such, but a thing that winds me up and I don't get -

the when turning left at a junction you have to give way to those turning right into it.
Its such a dumb stupied rule that seem so unnatural. I'm always getting it wrong. regardless if I'm turing left (and have to give way) or turning right so I have right of way but I keep giving way to those turning left.
*sigh*
Hopefully I'll get used to it - soon. :D

[jan]

I'm afraid i have voted a few.

Money- we are very very worse off here.
Housing- is a lot more expensive than I expected.
Feeling of homesickness stronger- the length of the journey magnified, just how far away we actually are.
Feeling of homesickness lasted longer- it can hit you hard at any unsuspecting moment, a song, a sighting of someone similar or just general thoughts.

When I was asking GB to NZ questions 12 months ago, I must admit to only reading what I wanted to read in a post. While in the Uk I never believed things to be as bad as they where there, but when you get here, as the saying goes `The grass is always greener on the other side` reality does hit you. I was on a cloud on our journey here. People in the Uk would say `How are you going to manage without your family?` and in a very blaze reaction replied `Oh I will be fine`. And I am not. Now there would have been lots of homesickness posts when I was coming over, but as I said, I only read what I wanted in a post.

So for me, if you can or want to, you will read into someones post what you want. I was coming over here whether or not, so didnt really like to read any negative posts. Don't know if I have made a mistake in my readings and kidded myself or..............

Every single family/person coming over here, comes for their own reasons . So my problems being homesick is very laughable to somebody else, as being called a pommie is to me. ( who cares)

We went with our gut feelings and dont regret a single moment.

[DLW]

Hi Jan,

I was wondering whether I chose not to look at the negative posts, previous to emigrating or did I only skim through them, or...wasn't there as many as there are now? I really can't remember seeing many, which is why I thought this thread should be continued.

It's easy to have a wonderful image of the place you want to be, and I think mine was unrealistic, if I had read a thread like 'perception to reality' it might have made me be more realistic or re-assess.

NZIS paint (in my opinion!) an unrealistic picture (especially the financial side of things - which I think might prove to be the biggest shock for alot of people) and, of course they would, it's their job to promote it. There has got to be something in the fact that there are more leaving NZ month on month than arriving! I know stats can be manipulated and it depends on the translation....but something that will always stick with me is....after a few days of arriving, I was at the park with my kids and started chatting a lady who had been here over forty years and one of her first questions, after the usual...where are you from etc.....was Why did you come here and not Australia? I thought this was an extremely strange question to ask at the time, now I see why she asked it!

I know there would also be a chance that things in Oz wouldn't be as expected, but from what I can gather the reason the majority of kiwis leave to go there is financial. And although I wouldn't say I'm overly materialistic, it's the reason we go out to work etc, and it would be nice to think that you were paid a reasonable wage, in comparison to the cost of living!

Not saying that I'm about to up sticks, but I wish someone had pointed out that there are alot of kiwis who leave NZ to go work in Oz to me and it might have made me think a little about that.

[veronica]

Hey Miffy, you missed a tax or two. GST (12 1/2%) on most stuff you buy and the import taxes that you pay indirectly, 19% on clothing. varying amounts on other stuff.

[veronica]

About the negative posts, I think they have always been there, but would suspect they are worse in the winter than in the summer. Some of us here have tried to tell people the houses / heating situation but it really doesn't sink in 'til you have experienced it.

[jewelsvani]

I will be going over next august and I am truly grateful for the reality versus perception thread it has allowed me to see the reality of living in NZ. I did have a good idea as I lived in AUS for a year so things like the banks, housing expense etc I know about. The financial situation I didnt know about so its good to know about that and also the heating situation and the build quality of the houses I didn't.

To be honest that thread has just made me want to go more now, it is as I expected it to be. I think my girlfriend and I are lucky because we are not very close to our families (free spirits if you like) so home sickness is not going to be a problem. If it is I will be very suprised we have both spent long periods away from our families and not felt home sick at all. Even now we live 400 miles away from them and see them on average once or twice a year, which suits us fine.

Obviously I haven't voted (due to not living there) but I am looking foward to the results of the poll.

[chips]

One thing i have found really hard here is the lack of job opitunities outside of main cities.
We live in Kaitaia, often bypassed by many for the wrong reasons. Newspapers and the media in general can paint a squiffy picture sometimes.
I thought it was going to be full of black power raging moari's ,graffitti and drugs. To my surprise there is none on show. I agree they are around ,but you have to move in those circle's to meet them. And as yet there have been no murders since we have been here. ( i only say this because of my preconceptions).
People are great , helpful and SHARING. Having shared Kai at lunch times at the special school i work in part time is great. Parents come in with excess fruit, veg and eggs.

But what has help more than anything ,in the darkest depths of homesickness and sadness,( and yes , i thought it wouldn't happen, but it does even if you are not close to your family) the weather has helped the most. I have forgotten what it's like to be really cold . Even at it's coldest here ,it was 4. Granted , houses are not up to much ,but with a log burner it's fine. And the coldest mornings are clear ,so by about 10 is warmed up nicely. I have yet to wear a winter coat. Next year i probably will as i will have aclimatised.

I would have believed that being warm and seeing and feeling the sun so often can have a profound effect. Especially if prone to depression.

Remember - you are the same person that steps on that plane at Heathrow/ Gatwick or Manchester ,and you are the same person who steps off in Aotearoa
Chips.

[markkellaway]

I haven't voted because, to be honest, I can't say anything surprised me. I don't think it's true to say that there is little negative info. available about NZ, and the Kiwi's leaving for Oz, the UK and the rest of the world is very well known, the brain drain is after all the reason most of us could get in!!! I have been amazed a number of times since being here how many people have arrived with very little research under their belts, like being surprised at the houses, the salaries etc.

One other thing, and I seem to be the odd one out here, I don't find the NZ drivers that bad, certainly no worse than the UK, in fact a whole lot less agressive. I drive 60 km a day to and from work and find the trip SO MUCH more relaxing than my 12 miles in the UK.

As fir the cost of things I actually think it s OK. Yes you have to shop around but other than that you really can live on a budget.

Cheers,

Mark. :)

[Diny]

I've always known the houses are cold (IMHO). I've stayed with my inlaws in the 3 different houses they've lived in over the last 16 years. Now I actually own and live in one of these houses the fact that they really are cold, damp and flimsy comes as no suprise. Knowing what to expect hasn't made it any easier. I'm trying SO hard to get use to living in this kind of building. The usual half cock advice about 'put on another jumper' is abit like teaching your granny to suck eggs. OF COURSE I'm going to put on another jumper if I'm cold .... derrrrrrr. I guess wearing several layers and a fleece inside will become 2nd nature within time.

The other big difference from home is the scenery - but having seen it before I knew it was spectacular - it still occasionally exceeds my expectations though.

Apart from that everything is pretty much as I expected it to be ...... very much like any other country I've lived in or visited. People are what makes a country - and people are the same the world over.

Diny

[Alex]

Good idea for the poll DLW, perhaps we could use this thread as "From perceptions to reality 2 - the thread strikes back"! Or should that be Episode V? The poll shows that housing is more expensive - and this was our primary reason for relocation...blasted estate agents, truly members of the dark side!

As for the original thread, all I'll say is that whilst I can see why it was closed, I think that its closure is a sad reflection really - if a discussion can't be full and frank, then is it worth having? Sure, a certain level of decency must be maintained in posting, but equally the discussion should be kept on track. Isn't this what we all want, not an involved deconstruction of a handful of comments that someone makes?

I, and many who use this forum, are about to emigrate, to radically change our lives, hopefully for the better. But how do we know we are making the right decisions, and how do we know that our choices aren't built on sand? Well, the logical answer is that you ask people who have done the same thing as you are about to do. I'd like to thank everybody who contributed to the original "perceptions" thread. The topic is complex and serious and touched on philosophical and personal choices, and the insight you have provided for me, and I hope to many others, has been fantastic. Whereas a mere few days ago, I had no actual knowledge of NZ, I now feel I am more able to make an informed decision. You have made this possible. Whether the thread would have exploded if "Jim" hadn't contributed is a moot point. Some of the "pre-Jim" posts were truly enlightening - look at Moorf's post http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4405&p=50682 and see the subtle points within, and look at the huge amount of info provided in the posts of the other people in NZ. The thread "post-Jim" turned into something else entirely, however, great advice and experiences can still be found.

NZ is a great place. Is it right for you? Who knows...come & see!

I think someone else pointed out on the thread that perception is reality, and opinions are to be used as a guide until you make your own mind up.

And so we come eventually to the point I wish to make.

Your perceptions are your reality.

And if you want to word that a little differently, then I refer you to the wonderful allegory that was provided by gil http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4389 and here by dave k.

So yes, perception is often reality, and reading your posts has made me realise that many of the things that I am unhappy about and that I see as being "bad" in the UK, (which I now know exist in NZ), can equally be remedied by a shift in my perceptions, a shift in my reality. Perhaps I would have realised this in time anyway, perhaps I wouldn't. The point is I realised this with the help of postings on here, before I came to NZ, before my humpty dumpty perceptions were shattered by the reality. I feel I am now better prepared, and that our move will have more chance of being a success. And yes, I am shitting myself about the move, but that's a good thing, because last week I wasn't.

Apart from that everything is pretty much as I expected it to be ...... very much like any other country I've lived in or visited. People are what makes a country - and people are the same the world over.

I have found this forum tremendously helpful and insightful. :nice1

[David with a dream]

Hi, as you may or may not know (depending on if you had read my post) we went and came back in super quick time. Yeah we both loved NZ how could you not and I didn't really want to leave but leave we did and who knows what the future holds for our family one day we may return. But if we do return we will know so much more about the place. Housing, wages, chocolate, watties beans, plug in rads etc. I guess what I'm trying to say in this ramble is even if we had known all the 'not so good bit' we would have still gone. It's dream chasing, it's hoping for a brighter future it's many things to many people. So yes my reality has shifted but not in a bad way just in a way that I now know what I didn't when we first said "lets live in NZ".
If your gonna do it then do it because you just don't know until you have tried, no matter how long you try for.
Good luck to you all and be happy because that is the essence of life.....David

[Diny]

Here's another good subject for the reality thread.

I remember back in the UK - if I wanted to contact one of the utility comapanies it would be a morning of sitting by the phone, choosing option 1,2 or 3, being put on hold, listening to cheesy elevator music .... ah yess, I remember it well. And how many times did I get cut off just as the android at the other end answered !!!

This morning I've needed to contact our local power company. Haven't had a bill since we moved in so was wondering if there was a 'blip' in the system.

OK - so I got the automated choices. But that's where the similarity ended. Just chose my option and whallah .... there was the info. No being put on hold, no cheesy music. I found out my account balance, the date of my last reading, the date of my next reading - all within about 30 seconds.

So - my perception ..... that the utility companies would be as irritating as they are back home.

My reality ...... they're not - they're blooming brilliant !!!!!

I just wish we had gas so I could test them out too.

Diny

[bob_the_engineer]

Two things I’d like to say slightly off thread, 1st (below) this is done in Yorkshire all the time, :yes so I shouldn’t have too much trouble here! Although its not the law, it’s thought of as rude not giving way to a car turning right when your turning left, particularly in traffic.


ooh that was a long post.

Not really a perception as such, but a thing that winds me up and I don't get -

the when turning left at a junction you have to give way to those turning right into it.
Its such a dumb stupied rule that seem so unnatural. I'm always getting it wrong. regardless if I'm turing left (and have to give way) or turning right so I have right of way but I keep giving way to those turning left.
*sigh*
Hopefully I'll get used to it - soon. :D


2nd Diny I hear that (about the utilities), the worst experience I had was not when I had to go through all the “press button” “enter your customer account number into the phone” blah blah, please hold. Good day sir what’s your account number! (did you get me to enter it into the phone to wind me up)

No it was the time when I used a debit card to pay an electric bill and they stuck a zero onto the amount they debited from my card.

When I rang and demanded the money back a very sweet lady who didn’t have a great command of the language told me that the money couldn’t be refunded electronically because the company felt that a cheque would be the most ELEGANT way to refund my money!

I gave up and waited 3 weeks to get a £1000 refund for their mistake! It wasn’t a particularly elegant cheque :D and I don’t pay my bills by switch anymore.

Bob

[dave k]

And if you want to word that a little differently, then I refer you to the wonderful allegory that was provided by gil http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4389 and here by dave k.



Damn...musta missed Gil's post. Who'd a thunk it? :nice1

[Carol]

I voted for 7!



When we came - we didnt have a forum to ask for help........in fact we didnt even have email!
So I suppose it is no wonder I fund it very very hard to adjust - and in some ways I still am.

Ah well.....

[Moorf]

I can't even begin to imagine what it would have been like to move here without the benefit of the internet, email, webcams etc... :no

I voted for houses being more expensive - but then with the crappy exchange rate and the big rises over the last couple of years or so, my property price research was out of date before we even landed!! :roll

[Singel]

I vote for houses being more expensive because we have to pay a lot more to live in a safe neighbourhood. I have lived in several countries in the past 8 years and homesickness has never been an issue to me. Making regular phone calls to my mum to make sure that she is well and good.

I have a mentality like "starting a new balance sheet" when I migrant to a new country. I tend not to compare things. I take everything in my own strive, be flexible/adaptable and important bit, stay positive when meet with disappointments.

Any way, we love it here - the people, the weather, the work and living environment :cheers