[Stephen Jones]

Hello All,

I have determined that any move my family and I may make to NZ will probably not leave us any better off financially than we are now.

If we do move it will not be based solely on financial reasons bu to the perceived benefits that a change in location and lifestyle may also bring us.

Has anyone who has moved to NZ found that they improved their lifestyle on the budget available to them or has it had the opposite effect?

Some examples from you all would be helpful.


Stephen & Lynn

[Charlosparky]

I have determined that any move my family and I may make to NZ will probably not leave us any better off financially than we are now.




I am in the same boat- we will definitely be on a budget in NZ and on top of that i will have to get used to going to "proper" work :eek: instead of being self employed and doing 4 days a week, but i am convinced that the less stressfull lifestyle (and not having my work at home) will be better for us all. We are submitting ITA in jan but has anyone actually got there and feels better for it even though they are skint? :confused: I hope so cos we are past the point of giving up now.

[Wannaway]

We have been in NZ a year now and we have found that the question that you need to ask yourself is "will the drop in standrad of living be compensated for by increased quality of life". For the vast majority of people coming to NZ, I would reckon that standard of living will drop, some a lot some marginally. The quality of life part of the equation is a trickier one, because that means different things to different people and you have to experience the Kiwi way of life to be able to evaluate "quality of life".

Our standrad of living has dropped a lot, not necessarily in the day to day things but certainly in terms of being able to plan financially for the medium to long term. As for quality of life, some things have improved but certain key areas haven't (eg I work longer hours here than I did in the UK for approx 45% of my UK salary/having no family near and therefore non cheap babysitters makes a parents' night out very expensive so rarer than we had in the UK). However, access to parks, beaches, a good school, excellent extra curricular activities for the kids go the other way. I am still struggling with the question of whether the drop in standrad of living has been compensated for by improved quality of life and whether we remain in NZ or not remains a 50/50 proposition..........

[Diny]

I am still struggling with the question of whether the drop in standrad of living has been compensated for by improved quality of life and whether we remain in NZ or not remains a 50/50 proposition..........


I agree.

Our situation is a little different. Because Mark works for an oil company and his 'office' can be anywhere in the world, he has stayed in the same job. The only difference now is that he flies to Egypt (soon moving to West Africa again) from Auckland airport instead of Manchester.

Putting the financial side of this topic to one side (he still gets paid the same as in the UK) - and commenting on the quality of life. I have to say no, the quality of life we have here is no better than we had in the UK. But saying that it's certainly no worse. The words 'same dance different disco' come to mind.

Diny

[boltonlass]

Hi steven and family
I have to agree with the others, you may be financially no better or worse of over. Although you may find your stress levels in relation to the rest of your life rocket down. Which does compensate for the rest.
Its all about weighing up the pros and cons of the move. I never did either as i just came for 4wks and 5 years later im still here. Due to return home next march permanantly. Im sure i will regret it.
lLifestyle is A++++ here much more relaxed and I am sure you will see that for yourself when you get here.
Good Luck and be prepared ]
Sarah

[lindajax]

hi all,
we've been here nearly a year and I'd say from a financial point of view its much of a muchness really BUT our standard of living is way better and we do feel much better off here really.
Linda x

[jonSE]

Like lindajax also been here nearly a year. Financially about the same but hopefully will be actually better off when OH finds an appropriate job (There aren't many around for her skillset.

Lifestyle - Work is pretty much the same for me as I do the same job (diff employer)and spend too much time doing it as I did in the UK but get paid the same in pounds. But we didn't have a 180 degree view of the sea from our 2 bedroom flat in London or live on a wacky Island - nuff said.

[adamsat]

We've been here 6 months now and in pure financial terms life is pretty much the same. I commute and work in an office job, I earn about 15% less and don't get any perks, taxes and rates are a little less, the mortgage is pretty similar, the house is about the same size, just on 1 floor rather than two.

The only real difference is now when I look out from the font door I see mountains and the back garden is about 2000 times the size it was.

[colindp]

Only been in NZ for three months so I guess it is a bit too early to properly evaluate things, however I so far see little or no difference. In terms of monthly pay I am worse off to the tune of 6K(pounds, but then it was never about the money….honest!!). My OH is not working at the moment so perhaps when she does get something that will ease the situation.
Because I am working for an accredited employer the advice I was given was to apply for work to residence visa, this works well for me and OH but I have a 19yr old son for whom it is causing great difficulty; he was only allowed a visitors visa and attempts to change this have been met with a brick wall. He has been turned away from the Police, Fire, Ambulance and NZ Air force because he is not perm resident; I have looked into applying for residency I am lucky enough to generate more than the sufficient number of points, unfortunately although having been in NZ for such a short time we still have to go through all of the medical, X-ray, Police report thing all over again which would not help the finances at all.
Living in Dunedin I do not have the nice views that so many others to this site are enjoying, I admit that there are some wonderful places around the city and Indeed some of the most spectacular scenery ever created is within a couple of hours drive but it does not compensate for a happy and contented family. I have to stay with my employer for three years as they assisted us with our move out here, however I can honestly see us pulling the plug and returning to Blighty after the expiry of my bond with my employer. Unless?????????????

[foolsgold99]

In cash terms we are a little bit worse off here, in the uk I earned about 40k a year, and Sal about 10k working part time. We had a 95K mortgage and were comfortable enough I guess. Here we have a $209k mortgage, on a house worth $400k. Interest rates are high, but will fall next year.

Here I earn $73k as a basic, with bonus I'd expect that to go up to $85k - $90k. In NZ terms I think this is a pretty good salary, perhaps double the average national wage. Sal earns nothing, as we have just had a baby. That would have been the same in UK. In simple cash terms we earn 1.5K GBP less a month.

Having said all that, is our standard of living hurt by being down 1.5k gbp a month. I'd have to say not at all, if anything I may feel a little richer. I don't find things that expensive in the shops, my purchasing power doesn't seem to be that reduced. Only thing that seems expensive is international travel. A high wage economy is also a high price one.

I have to say that i'm happier than I've ever been in my life. Yesterday evening we went to the beach with the boy and the dog. We ate ice creams under blue skies and sunshine, and I went for a swim in the clean waters of the south pacific. It felt pretty good.

In my garden I have mature mandrian / lemon / grapefruit / guva / merlot vine. I've planted naval oranges, avacados, chillies, peppers and tomato this year. I can spent a couple of hours working in my garden looking after my plants, and be very happy doing it. In the UK I couldn't grow 90% of this stuff, for me it's a dream come true.

I look forward to sending my son to school here, the kids seem so balanced and together, doesn't seem to the same culture of fear as in other countries

I don't want to accuse anyone of being a wpb, but thinking about cash you had before is pointless. you need to look at what you've got and embrace it, you can make a fantastic life style here.

[Hannah]

Can't comment on quality of life for me as i've spent much of the last 6 wks that i've been in NZ finishing my MSc dissertation and applying for jobs, filling out student visas, connecting my phone, opening bank accounts, sorting out gas/elec bills etc etc.
but for kids this is a terrific lifestyle. School is far better for them than the UK (I know some have issues with schools here being more academically relaxed but it's suiting my children a treat - they hated school in UK and yet here they don't want to break up for holidays). They have a more relaxed lifestyle, more freedom, more exciting experiences etc. than where we lived before (we are near the sea here, so that opens a lot of fun opportunities for them).
Children don't worry about PR applications, work permits, bills or buying second hand cars, and i can see why many people come to NZ and stay for their children. Not sure yet how i feel about me personally, and what i would feel if i wasn't seeing my children enjoying this place so much. Maybe i just need to get beyond the paperwork phase and start enjoying the place a bit more.
what strikes me most is how relaxed parents are around children - not hassling them all the time, telling them what to do, not to do this or that, or telling them to 'come on' or 'stay there' all the time. They let them just be. there is also less stress on primary kids to buy sports gear, trendy shoes (or any shoes for that matter!). It's not seen cool here to have a fifty quid footie shirt, it's more cool to do a stunt on your bike down the skate park while wearing ripped trousers (according to my ten year old anyway). maybe thats different at high school - don't know as my kids aren't there yet.
To sum up - great place for children, for adults - let me get a job and some money (and the option of staying here!!) and i'll let you know!
hannah

[Smiler]

This was a hard one for me to answer.

We had a comfortable lifestyle in the UK but in May 05 I gave up my 30k job to help run our IT business. Income is steady from that and getting better. Gary was contracting now and again which was good ££'s. We didn't have a mortage but our rent was probably double most peoples mortgage, and our spending power was good. We had the odd blip if customers accounts were'nt paid in time, but we managed, like you do. We were also debt free.

Here G is earning his equivelant salary worth in GBP, something that we thought would be impossible and our business is paying a steady income too, in saying that we could just survive on the business, if G hadn't needed the job for PR.

However at this point it really isn't about what the money can bring us. It's about the lack of the 3 hour round train trip to London or the 2.5 hour slog round the M25. There are more plus points than money can buy. The views, the scenery, the not keeping up with the Joneses, not having to have labels or a fancy car. No one stares at me if I go shopping in jandals and cut offs, because they are wearing them too.

To illustrate this, we lived in a tiny place near Liphook in Hants and at lunch time we often used to walk out on the common and have our lunch looking over a place called the view point. It was nice but you could always hear the distant rumble of the A3 traffic and the view was lovely, but narrow, I always wanted to see a bit more and couldn't.

Today for lunch I grabbed sushi whilst shopping and took it along the Oriental Bay, which is a fairly busy road by NZ standards. I sat there in the sunshine and everywhere I looked there was something different to see, busy city (which I would have shied away from before), beach, harbour and shipping, sail boats, people swimming and lazing about and the spectacular back drop of the hills/mountains surrounding welly. Sometimes you can see dolphins in the bay.Today I still felt more happy and peaceful than I ever did before sitting at the viewpoint in Lynchmere. That is the sort of quality I have added to my life by coming to NZ and when I realised I could answer this post after all.

Deborah

[Carol]

Because I have been here so much longer than most I would have to say yes - overall.
But...


There are pockets where the answer is most definitely no.
Extended family support being the main one.

[Radders]

This will be our second christmas, our first in the Mount, we earn 30% less here than we did in the UK, but we work slightly more hours (and at the moment most of mine are at night, unlike the UK). However it is a 20 min return commute ( one of my jobs I walk to)instead of an average of 2 and a half hours, so we are both actually home earlier, and leave later than we used to.
We live 5 mins from the beach, where I can surf when I want to. We run along the beach and round the mount instead of round blocks of houses. I am far more relaxed here, than in the Uk.
We have no mortgage yet, but I don't think it will be anymore painful than in the UK.
We have less 'extra' cash, but I have a savings account here that I never had in the UK! We eat out less, or eat out for lunch instead of dinner. It's difficult to explain. I work hard and haven't had more than 2 days off in a row for almost a year ( and that only recently), but I haven't even thought about taking a holiday - I feel on holiday most of the time.
I was never one for expensive clothes etc, but there is less pressure for that sort of thing here too, less pressure all round I'd say.
I have a great life here, I don't think I could give it up, for a few extra dinners out, a newer car, and that sort of thing

[KD17]

Very interesting reading. I wonder how we might fair when we finally get out there.

Our lifestyle here on the IOM is pretty good I suppose, salaries are higher than in the UK, taxes are much, much lower, we get full tax relief on the total mortgage value & all loans (except credit cards). Crime is very low, as is unemployment, and it is a safe place for children with beautiful scenery - but not as pretty as NZ I'm positive of that.

Based on that we could have a bit more adjusting in some areas, but others I guess would be very similar. it's expensive to get off the IOM, and the general costs of living is slightly higher than the UK.

One of the reasons we are going to NZ, is that the people here, in my opinion, are very cliquey, not friendly and very pretentious. I am hoping that NZ will be totally the opposite from that view point - the rest I'm sure we can live with.

Hopefully we'll get to find out mid 2006

:yes

Keith & Debby

[ruthyroo]

Hmmm... I think our way of life has changed for sure - whether it's better or not is another question.... and my feelings on that change frequently. Is different the same as better when you actually enjoyed your 'old' life? Not necessarily.

When we have had money / job troubles here, all the scenery / space in the world etc didn't make a blind bit of difference. But when we don't have any financial woes, and everything is ticking along nicely, it's great to have such beautiful places to explore. So if you have the financial side sorted (and by that I mean you are earning enough to cover needs, some wants and something for the future) then you may well have the freedom to enjoy all that NZ has to offer. But in my experience, you can't underestimate the destructive power of financial stress. I'm not good at forgetting about things like that and just enjoying the (free) scenery. So my advice is to always be honest in your planning about how much money you need to live on - and whether you will really be happy 'surviving' on less if need be. Some people are better at it than others. I'm not bad at actually drawing in the pursestrings - but god I find it unsettling when I have to.

TBH for us (no kids yet), we would probably have been happy with an extended holiday in NZ - see and experience all the good things while earning and spending GBP! A lot of people I have met here seem to agree that NZ is great for families and for bringing up young children (all the space, relaxed schools, camping, very family oriented society) but maybe a bit limited in the long term if your horizons are wider than the next tramp / surf / camping trip. There's a reason so many young kiwis / graduates disappear overseas for years - then come back when they have young families.

So does the quality of life make up for drop of income? Yes if you genuinely value camping / tramping / surfing / views / space / gardening etc enough to sacrifice some degree of financial security. No if the lack of financial security will keep you awake worrying at night and leave you too pooped / freaked out to enjoy all the above!

[Going2NZ]

Interesting viewpoints from all. I love hearing other people's perspective.

Now, for me. I certainly understand financial stress. I arrived in mid-October with the idea that I would be able to land a job within a month or so given that my profession was on the shortage list. Although I received an offer after only two weeks, it wasn't in a location we wanted to be in or likely to give either of us any other opportunities. So I've managed to stretch my budget as thin as possible over here while my sweet husband is trying to wrap his last semester working on his master's degree back in the US. <I guess we should have waited until Jan to make the move but circumstances forced things>

Anyhow, the lifestyle question. Despite the stress, being in New Zealand has made it all worthwhile. Being able to walk along the harbour in Wellington, go to the museum, visiting Christchurch and the botanical gardens, seeing the penguins in Dunedin, meeting incredibly friendly and supportive people everywhere (kiwis and expats) and just breathing the air here has kept me going past the point where I would have given up and gone home. I'm just now starting to look for a real home after being a permanent transient for the last couple of months so I can't speak to the everyday issues yet but I can't imagine going back to my old life. I don't miss the horrible traffic, trash everywhere, terse and cranky people or the job that grew into a bureaucratic nightmare. My only regret is that my husband has continued to deal with all of that while I have the freedom to sit and have coffee with a friend and a glorious view of the beach. I'm sure we'll have our bad days but this is our life now.

On the practical side, I haven't seen the high prices others have talked about. The cost of groceries has been a bit high for me because I don't have the space at a backpackers to store anything in bulk and I'm buying smaller sizes since its just me. The pre-made stuff seems pricier but I rarely buy those so no real difference. The farmers markets are the way to go for fruits and veggies since those do seem more expensive in the groceries. But the times that I've gone shopping for clothes, the prices seem close to what Im used to. Granted, you still have to figure out where to go for the best deals. I've seen t-shirt type tops for $110 <can't imagine spending that for a t-shirt even if I had Julia Robert's clothing allowance!> but I've also seen nice fleeces for $13. All of this is true of any new place you move to, it just takes a little time to find places that suit your taste and your budget. After owning a home, paying rent goes against the grain but the amounts seem reasonable. I plan on avoiding buying a car until I have to since I love being able to hop on a train and get just about anywhere. Decent public tranportation was almost non-existent in central Texas. So, short of finding a used car for hauling the dogs to the vets and doing big grocery trips, I'm hoping to do without. Even at that, car prices are much better than the US.

But its not all about the views. I've had to consciously make myself slow down. At first walking in Wellington drove me crazy - why was everyone going SO SLOW? Then I realized that the real question was - why did I have to rush so much? Habit. A lifetime of getting things done now and not stopping to smell the roses, have a cup of coffee or stop and watch a momma duck with her ducklings for a few minutes or enjoy a fresh breeze off the harbour. So, for me, the key to the lifestyle is not just changing your location but changing yourself. New Zealand is just geography. You don't get the lifestlye issued with your PR or stamped into your brain when they stamp your passport. Just getting here doesn't change anything, you have to do that yourself.

Wow, talk about stream-of-consciousness. Off on a tangent again but I've been thinking a lot about this lately. I know there can be insurmountable (spelling?) problems and I don't have children so I can't judge on that end of things. Its taken more money, documentation and time just to get our dogs approved than it did for us to get PR so I realize there are practical issues too. Personally, I'd rather deal with these problems once and build a life than slog through the same c**p everyday wishing I'd tried to make a change.

Susan

[Diny]

Is different the same as better when you actually enjoyed your 'old' life? Not necessarily.

So my advice is to always be honest in your planning about how much money you need to live on - and whether you will really be happy 'surviving' on less if need be.

A lot of people I have met here seem to agree that NZ is great for families and for bringing up young children (all the space, relaxed schools, camping, very family oriented society) but maybe a bit limited in the long term if your horizons are wider than the next tramp / surf / camping trip. There's a reason so many young kiwis / graduates disappear overseas for years

So does the quality of life make up for drop of income? Yes if you genuinely value camping / tramping / surfing / views / space / gardening etc enough to sacrifice some degree of financial security. No if the lack of financial security will keep you awake worrying at night and leave you too pooped / freaked out to enjoy all the above!



As usual Ruth - a very sensible unblinkered posting. I agree totally.

Diny

[Stephen Jones]

Hello All,

I have determined that any move my family and I may make to NZ will probably not leave us any better off financially than we are now.

If we do move it will not be based solely on financial reasons bu to the perceived benefits that a change in location and lifestyle may also bring us.

Has anyone who has moved to NZ found that they improved their lifestyle on the budget available to them or has it had the opposite effect?

Some examples from you all would be helpful.


Stephen & Lynn


Thanks to all who have replied to my original posting. You have given us a lot of food for thought.

Steve & Lynn

[Avalon]

You know at first when i saw this question - my thought was "well no, our lifestyle isnt really any better", but at 6pm this evening we all went for a dip in our pool. Followed by burgers on the barbie and an invite to a neighbours birthday bash tomorrow (we havent met them yet). So i guess really in many mnay ways our lifestyle IS better.

BUT (and I know ive said this before so sorry if youve already seen it), many of the lifestyle changes we have benefitted from here, we were already making in the UK. These are things like not allowing work to interfere with our lives, dialling back on spending so that we went from debt to savings and learning how to manage cashflow. All of which reduced stress and allowed us to enjoy our lives - and all of which has helped us adjust to a more relaxed life here.

OH has changed jobs to get more pay (which just means we can save more rather than needing it for spending), adn to find a job he actually enjoys (he loved his UK job - strange but true), and this is one area which is still a bit shaky - hes really not sure about the second job either. Its early days though, and we get the impression that its not uncommon for frequent chages - especailly in his role. He speaks to many more people in other companies doing the same job, and its actually quite social - a HUGE change from the UK situation. And he really isnt expected to work till he drops.

As the summer kicks in - we are informed that OH will be jumping in the pool as soon as he gets home from work. I think he can live with that! :)

[Soon2baKiwi]

We've been here six months now and financially have more disposable income than we had back in Ireland - high prices over there mean that I find things here not so very expensive at all. We spend a lot more time together too because of much shorter commuting times so that's a HUGE change for us. We've got a social life which we didn't have before (mainly because of the time spent commuting) and every day I walk home from the bus stop feeling that I'm living in paradise. Our day to day lifestyle is much the same, get up early, work, home, eat, housework etc.etc. But I'm finding that I can actually relax and not feel that I have to constantly be doing something.

I don't like my my boss but the majority of my colleagues are wondeful. I will be looking to change as soon as the holidays are over and there are lots of good jobs around for a PA so I'm not too bothered.

The only real downside for me is that I seem to become easily infected by 'bites'. We (Doctor and I) think I may have had TWO spider bites but they may also have been mossies. Whatever, both times I've ended up in A&E, penicillin the first time and an intraveneous antibotic the second time. :no The good thing is that they are covered by ACC so I only had to pay to see the doctor on the first visit on both occasions. I've become a bit paranoid and am usually to be found slathered in insect repellant. There's a thing - do you put the insect repellant on OVER the sunscreen? Is one negating the other?

So, yes is the answer. We feel our lifestyle has certainly improved :clap

[Wannaway]

Hi,

See you live on the Shore and that you may be looking for another job in the New Year. I am not sure if this is protocol (guess it will get moderated out if not), but the firm I work for is always on the look out for good quality PAs, in fact we have a vacancy in my department (of about 80 people) coming up right after Xmas. The main downside is it is in the CBD, which may not be good for you in terms of commute, depends on whether or not you are near a ferry as we are right at Princes Wharf, so the Devonport/Stanley Bay/Bayswater/Birkenhead ferries go from right outside our door. The best bit about where I work is that I am on the 23rd floor and our kitchen has sweeping views of the Waitemata, from Takapuna right down the Devonport Peninsular taking in Rangitoto/Waiheke, through to the far Eastern Auckland city suburbs. On a sunny Friday afternoon, when all the sail boats are in the harbour, it's magical!

If you think there might be something worth following up PM me and we can exchange more information.

Wannaway

[Gran]

Dont worry too much about the mozzie bites etc. it wont go on forever, when you first change countries you will always be affected because the bacteria while not neccessarily worse, are different from the ones you have built up a resistance to over the years. The old mozzie injects you with a blood thinning substance, they love new pommie blood!!

[Diny]

I've been following this thread with much interest, it's good to read different preceptions. As usual there's no right or wrong, just the different opinons of different people.

I think the one thing that has come to the fore on more than one occasion is the reports of people saying that they don't miss the M25, the high rise cities and the over population and polution - hence their lifestyles here in NZ are (obviously) much improved. I think it's fair to say that the answer to 'have you improved your lifestyle' depends largely on what your lifestyle was back in your home country.

I was lucky enough to live a very rural 'chocolate box' lifestyle back home so things here aren't really much better, but like I've already said - no worse either.

One feeling that seems to run true through the entire thread (and many others) - whether our lifestyles have got worse, stayed the same or improved, I don't think any of us will regret giving it a go. We are the lucky ones - we're here 'living the life'. All I can say to those thinking about coming ....... DO IT !!!! ALL NZ AIRPORTS HAVE DEPARTURE LOUNGES AS WELL AS ARRIVAL LOUNGES !!!!!! If it doesn't work out at least you'll have found out for yourselves and you can go back home. And you won't die with the words 'we had the chance to move to New Zealand once' on your lips.

Good luck to all - come on in, the water's beautiful.

Diny

[kiwidebs]

ALL NZ AIRPORTS HAVE DEPARTURE LOUNGES AS WELL AS ARRIVAL LOUNGES !!!!!!

Love that Diny - very sensible statement!! :nice1

Debs

[Al_S]

Hello All,

This is one of those philosophical questions. I am just joining the forum and topics such as these are very interesting and valuable. My wife and I are Canadians and run our own software consulting practice (incorporated) in TO. Our clients are both here and in the US so there is a lot of travel involved. Though the money is great, we are often stressed out because of the workload.

We are contemplating a move to either a smaller town within Canada (probably Victoria) or to NZ so that we could spend more time with our two little boys ( 4 and 1 ) and focus on the family life for a change.

I Just completed the EOI (haven’t submitted yet) and we score 140 so getting to the ITA stage and eventually to NZ should not be hard under the new rules (hopefully) but we come back to the same qu. as you; how is the life in NZ going to help us achieve what we are striving for? I guess no matter where you live you will always need to make compromises. There is no absolute "dreamland" but there is a thing called "dreamland in my opinion" and one has to come to that level of understanding and then be happy with the decision that has been made.

I agree the environment can contribute quite significantly to what one wants to accomplish in life (i.e. good infrastructure, health care, school system, fair judiciary, clean environment, decent economy, etc.) but at the end of the day the feeling of contentment is not going to be derived from external means...it has to be from within.

Sorry for the long note. All the best to you Steve and your family.

Al from TO

[Debbie]

One feeling that seems to run true through the entire thread (and many others) - whether our lifestyles have got worse, stayed the same or improved, I don't think any of us will regret giving it a go. We are the lucky ones - we're here 'living the life'. All I can say to those thinking about coming ....... DO IT !!!! ALL NZ AIRPORTS HAVE DEPARTURE LOUNGES AS WELL AS ARRIVAL LOUNGES !!!!!! If it doesn't work out at least you'll have found out for yourselves and you can go back home. And you won't die with the words 'we had the chance to move to New Zealand once' on your lips.

Good luck to all - come on in, the water's beautiful.

Diny

Thanks Diny.
Post xmas wobble stopped but such sound advice. Seeing the kids enjoy being with my parents so much over the hols has been lovley but hard.
Debbie

[wayne]

good question we have been here 5 months now and the main changes are
1. we bought our house outright as opposed to having a failing endowment with 12 years to run (that is the biggest change)
2. I was a teacher and my wife a school librarian , I now work longer hours and harder work as a structual welder/fitter, my wife works less hours but in a menial cleaning type job
3. we earn a lot less than in the UK joint income UK£40,000ish now joint income NZ$ 50,000 ish thats about half
4. we have no credit cards no loans and usually have a bit of spare cash each week.
5. how do I feel about the change ...BRILLIANT I swim in the pacific most days when the tide is right I tour some amazing scenery on my Harley, I have a beaten up 16 yr old ford ute (pick up) which I think is so cool !! and at night I can lay in bed look out the sky light window and see some of the brightest stars I have ever seen,I have made some good friends at the flying club(radio control models) a hobby which I never had time for in the UK(funny that as I work longer hours now)
yesterday I caught my first fish a Kahawai and barbecued it with lemon from our lemon tree and ate it ,that is something I never dreamed I could do .
In summary if you are into designer labels and 4x4's (dork mobiles as driven by Dorklander's) you will find it hard going if you are into skinny dipping at night and having your breath taken away daily just by looking out the window
DO IT!!!!!!!
this week I turn 48 I feel younger now than I have done in years
All the best in your decision Wayne

[Biddy]

Some fantastic posts here - just spent the last 20 mins from start to finish.

We moved to Waikanae just north of Welly about 3 months ago and absolutely love it.
I've not posted on here for some time (caught up in the whirlwind of change etc) and would rate the move as N0 5 in the 'best things in my life' - 1 - 4 being marraige to Sarah and birth of 3 beautiful kids - now 7, 6 & 4.
We owened a rural Post Office and stores in the UK so our change is not typical. We used to work 80+ hrs a week, 360 days a year!
I have now gone back to my old profession of Healthcare sales - so naturally have a heck of a lot more time to be with the family now.
However that notwithstanding I would say that our Q of life has improved dramatically. We live in a beautiful area - close to beach, hills & bush. We have bought 3 acres of land at Peka Peka (God I love that name!) with views of the beach, South Island, Kapiti island and on a clear day Mt Taranaki - all for the cost of a small terraced house in the south of UK. We will start to build in the next few months and should move in about July. We rent in Waikanae at the moment - $270 pw for a 3 bed house with good gdns and fantastic views.
I earn enough money to keep us fed and watered with trips to Pak n Save, the Warehouse and the local veggie stalls. We have simple needs. Sarah doesn't work as yet but should soon start an online course to convert her degree to become a primary school teacher.
We BBQ every night we can and enjoy the view. We take the dog for walks along the river, we visit the beach, the kids go off to play with their friends from school, we have friends over for coffee and meals, we're less stressed, my freckly celtic skin is now off white, we drive a 10 year old Honda Odessey and Nissan Prairie (both picked up cheap), we chat to strangers about anything really, we don't rush places, I wear shorts everyday I'm not working, my boss is great and is giving me plenty of time to settle in, we eat healthier, meat & fresh vegies seem so much more affordable, there's so much sun & scenery, we've got broadband and cheap calls to the UK, everyone's so friendly..........oh just everything really!!!

I know we're still in the honeymoon period but I really can't find anything to critisize. Yes things are different, and it's not perfect but it really doesn't seem far off. We're anticipating that homesickness kicking in soon, but we're prepared for it.

I expect to be back on this forum a bit more now and contributing when I can.

Oh - and I've discovered Monteiths Summer ale - Yum!

All the best
Mike

[Hannah]

I've been here 2 months now (in New Plymouth) and have to say the more i'm here the more i love it, and the more my life and the things we do as a family are changing for the better. Have tried quite a bit of the stuff mentioned already on this thread, and have found that the bills (household, shopping, car etc) are not as high as i first anticipated now that we've established ourselves better and know where and how to shop (and haggle).
I don't think i can say it's 'better' than the UK as things are so different in many ways that direct comparisons are not easy. There are things i like more and things i miss (familiarity and history being main ones, which cannot easily compare).
It's a different life here but i loved the UK too - we lived in a nice area with a job i loved so much i would have worked voluntarily if needed (sad :-( eh!!). However, i feel more willing now i've been here a while to make this a more permanent move. I appreciate it's differences and love the new opportunities - but i feel uncomfortable about just saying it's 'better' than UK. It's certainly very different! in a nice way!

[Paul and Linda]

Hello All,
I have just put the time into reading this thread, and everything in it we have felt to some extent.

Diny as always writes what I feel before I get a chance to type it out.

It seems to me that the people who spent a lot of time travelling, who don't have kids, who both worked and now still do, and who have managed to cut out the crap and focus on the stuff thats important to them appear to have benefitted the most from coming to NZ.

I have moved from a Lab supervisors/technical manager position and linda was working a few evening hours. There were limited places to go and we have always been on a failing budget. Like a few others we were beginning to accept that budget and manage to it (with all the consequences) when we started to consider NZ.

It appeared to be the answer to our prayers. From what we could tell we'd buy a house outright (very small one) and then just work to cover minimal bills.

What we have found is that inall the rush and hurry we sold the house way under the valuations we got, we spent twice as much on cars, I travel 10 hours a week to get to work, get up at 5.30 5 days a week. I am too tired to do much of an evening and we get the kids to bed by 7-8 oclock.

TV is crap, Sky is crap, we have no family to pop round to for a free drink or cup of tea!, we have no one to look after our kids without cost or at no notice and no one to look after them overnight for trips away etc. Our lovely stuff from the UK looks queer and crap in our house here and the insulation is so poor that you freeze on a cool night in the summer.

My new job that would have been nice to have been a downstep and closer to home is actually a massive upstep, which only just betters my UK salary with benefits included. My salary disappears without any effort, rent is higher (we sat on equity and a lower mortgage in the uk) elec/gas/phone is way higher, food appears to cost us way more than in the UK for stuff that's not as good (how can you ever beat ASDA?).

I would never be able to manage in NZ taking a less stressful job, the cost of living here is way too high compared to a few years ago (just like in the UK, although we were ahead of the crowd with a lot of things there, and going back would probably equate to where we are in NZ right now).

Missing your family for a week is hard (im off for a fortnight at the weekend), but you come back and try to make up for it. Missing your family in the UK is hard, but you think that it will just be christmas etc and the initial not seeing them.

I'm starting to realise that all the people who talked about emigrating to NZ or coming to stay for 6 months at a go, aren't going to (probably). That having family in Oz is a waste of time cos on what we are earning we can't afford to see them (an vice versa, they aren't loaded over there).

Yes, school, extra curricular, pools, beach, bikes, countryside (mostly farms by the way and we are so isolated from anywhere here in Taranaki)one story houses with what looks like more land than in the UK, but is mainly driveway, garage and deck or front garden.

It's harder living here than in the UK for me, some things are better for my family, but for me it's a harder life with little sleep tonnes of stress and no flippin money, and that's not what I was looking for.

Linda's feeling that as a family we've got more out of it than we were getting out of life in the UK, but as individuals, it's me who's tipping the balance/making that difference, and that upsets her.

It aint all roses, the sight of cows and fields and mountains and beaches may just not make up for the feeling of being isolated from the rest of the world, my family and the life I grew up with and .....looking back probably didn't want to give up.

OOH that's a biggie, got some difficult stuff to work through, if things calm down a bit here, then my job and hours and travel won't change, I still will always miss my family, ......will I have improved my life? No, whatever we did in the UK we did to keep us happy and keep us going, what we do here whilst it looks and sounds better, aint making me happy.

It's all about individuals, if my job were better, if we were better off financially, if I were happier, we'd be here forever, cos no one else in my family has the same problems as me and they are getting the benefits that we thought they would get out of coming here.

Leaves me with a lot of thinking about to do. My only advice to others (if they need it or it applies) is, make sure that you as an individual will get enough out of being here to make you happy. Your families happiness is important, but no matter how important that is to you, if you yourself are not seeing the benefit it probably won't work for you.

All the best to everyone,especially those lucky buggers for whom this emigration lark has come up roses.

Cr@p here comes the rain, here comes winter, it was sunny 2 seconds ago!(and yes I realise that that also applies to a lot of other things.....but it really has just started to rain!)

Paul

[Diny]

some things are better for my family, but for me it's a harder life with little sleep tonnes of stress


......will I have improved my life? No, whatever we did in the UK we did to keep us happy and keep us going, what we do here whilst it looks and sounds better, aint making me happy.





Paul - you and I are obviously on the same wave length - couldn't agree more with what you say.

Diny

[colindp]

Paul and Linda,
You have hit the nail precisely on the head and echoed my sentiments exactly. Whilst I appreciate that for a lot of people coming to NZ has been totally what they had hoped, unfortunately for myself and my family this has not been the case, my salary is crap and currently we are struggling to survive; this never happened in the UK. I thought that I had been carefull to ensure that my earnings here would be sufficient to live on and the promise of a cheaper cost of living has yet to materialise
It took ages to find a house that was fit for human habitation and I need a forest the size of a planet to keep the thing warm. I commute longer distance, I can't park where I work, so I now get a lift so far with my OH and walk the rest, I work longer hours than in the UK, I was on flexi time in the UK which I think is great, my wife doesn't like it nor does my son. So I hear all those of you who it has worked for saying well why don't you just go then... Well that is the itention as soon I can possibly manage it we'll be gone....But all said and done I am not sorry at least we gave it a go.

[Paul and Linda]

spot on colin, I'd be hard pressed to give up on the stuff that is making linda and the kids happy, and ti has spent a large deal of what we had to get here, but when you gotta go you gotta go.

PS so many people have commented on the cost of living and that it seems to be cheaper. I wonder are they really sure. I've spent a lot of time looking into it and I believe that it is more expensive to live here, taxes are higher, state benefits are non existant, dentist and doctors fees will just about drown you, and blooming cars cost the earth even for complete heaps!

Other factors obviously include did you manage to transfer your equity or did you spend too much of it in settling, ours is the latter.

[colindp]

Paul,
Unfortunately when we left the UK we were living in rented accommodation and so came here with just our savings, but as I mentioned it took ages to find a house that we all felt was fit to live in and yet although we are only a few K's out of town we have no mains water supply and no mains sewage.
I have not seen any sign of the alleged cheaper cost of living and I am ashamed to say that life is great struggle at the moment.
Fortunately in our case we are all of the opinion that enough is enough; four years ago we went to live in the USA and life was great, great salary, great lifestyle, great location(mountains & lakes) great Weather, sadly my mother was diagnosed with cancer and we went back to the UK to care for her, we hoped that the move here would be another bite of the cherry but this has not been the case. Still I have another chance, I am interviewing tomorrow for a job back in the US...I just hope that I can raise the funds to get there if i get the job!!!!!
I would still encourage those who are thinking about it to go for it, just because it didnt work out for us does not mean it would not work out fine for them....

[G&K]

Blimey !

Been a really interesting thread to read - with both sides of the coin expressed really well... Sorry if things are harder for some than they anticipated - hope things work out for you in the end.

For us it has been a MUCH better experience...

I guess it depends on where you were before and what you standard of living, salary housing etc was...

We lived in a 1 bedroom flat in London before moving to Wellington - we couldn't see a way of buying anything bigger without moving out of the big smoke, and we want to start a family... That would mean commuting for anything between 2 -3 hours a day to stay in my job or looking to move somewhere else.

We then thought if we're going to move, then let's MOVE ! So here we are in Wellington...

I must say we LOVE it - we're by the sea and can see mountains all around. I'm lucky my salary is the same as London - but my rent is half my mortgage. We're renting the flat out until we decide what we want to do for now...

We've got a dog - which we take camping most weekend in THE most amazing scenery I've ever seen, and we love being so close to the great outdoors. We go Kayaking a couple of times a week and feel much healthier than we ever did in London...

Sure we miss friends and family, but we call them a lot and email them with photo's of our latest adventures... They rarely have done half as much as we have as the Pub still rules their social calender...

We bought Season Tickets for the Hurricanes for the price of one ticket to an International or Premiership game at home (If you were lucky enough to find a ticket)

Riding my motorbike here is a joy rather than the neccesity it was in London and we don't worry about the cost of diesel to fill up the 4 x 4 ( rather than sticking a tenner in the car in U.K as we could NEVER afford to fill it !)

I've not had a parking ticket, and you can generally find somewhere to park - even on a Saturday shopping trip.

I haven't thought about smoking when I do go out - even though I gave up over a year ago, as pubs and bars are smoke free and not the stinky smoky places at home.

So in short - the answer to "Has or Lifestyle Improved in N.Z" is MOST DEFINATELY.
Will we be here for ever - who knows, but everyday we are we are thankful...

Horses for courses I suppose

;-)

[Stephen Jones]

When I started this thread i didn't realise the massive response and pouring out of views and feelings that I would receive....

Thanks to all who have responded to my original question.

I believe I have received examples of both 'good' and 'bad' experiences...and have an idea now that not all of the grass is greener on the other side.


Thanks to one and all

Steve

[Amerikiwi]

I`m a small business owner, doing the same thing I did in America, and working as hard as I ever did in America, but my bank account is still showing the same balance as when I arrived here 21 months ago. Cost of living here eats up all the profits, unfortunately.