[Nicola]

Hi

Does anyone know if there is a problem with Weil's from rats in NZ.
We have just moved into a property with a creek at the bottom of the garden. Which is wide enough for the kids to splash about in. But there are rats about.
Can I let the kids mess about in the water or do I have to keep them away.

[Kim39]

Can't really comment on this as i don't have an answer, but just be careful. Try asking locally and see what answers you get. Do know of late though that there has been a big thing on levels of algae in still waters. Must be careful as i suffered a few years back with shigallea, mild form of typhoid through algae levels being high.

Kim

[meely&paul]

Hi Nicola, if there are rats about then so will weil's disease! l would keep the kids away.
the stream is also at the bottom of my garden and l dont let the kids play in it. you can never be to careful.


meely

[mossum]

hiya nicola

I'd say let the kids go for it - we really worry ourselves silly about everthing now - I grew up in NZ & was forever mucking about in rivers & streams & have lived to tell the tale . I also fished for years in the UK with no problems - & i beleive that weils can be a problem for anglers too .

Given half the chance I'd be splashing about in the river - making dams - looking for little fish - floating on the current - all marvelous fun

heres a web link http://www.leptospirosis.org/medical/ although it is a usa site .

afraid its a decision only you can make for your kids but thought i'd chip in with my bit - HTH

vic

[veronica]

our kids used to canoe in the uk and we just made sure that if they had aN open wound then it would be covered and waterproofed before and cleaned well after.

[Diny]

I grew up on a farm which inevitably had rats. We would swim in the pond and the brook and never caught anything nasty. The water over here is much cleaner so I'd say you'll be OK.

May be an idea asking at the local health centre - maybe they could tell you if there's been any cases recently.

Diny

[Yogi]

I am no doctor so don't sue me if I wrong, but though Weil's disease was much more likely in still water (eg lakes) and that in flowing water like stream or river flow would make it much less likely.

Played in rivers lots as a kid myself and never had problems, only have heard of it from lakes and he like.

Cheers,

Yogi.

[Koen]

Weil's comes from rats and tru swimming in contaminated water i guess they dont like rivers as much as still water.

[willsken]

I spent so much time as a child playing in the river in the UK. I know if I had a river at the bottom of the garden I would let my boys play in it. Only a parent can make that decision for their child. It was a good idea mentioned re speaking to the local health center.

[Nicola]

Thanks for all the replies. I played in rivers and streams when I was a kid in the UK and never had any problems. But as a very over protective mum, I thought I would check. Peter reckons since I have got used to the idea of earthquakes now I am just looking for something else to worry about:roll .

The idea about the local health centre is a great one.

I would love for Callum to be able to splotch about down there making dams and bridges and getting very muddy. At the moment the giant eel that lives under the bank keeps them out of the water. And all the flooding we have had last week. There is now enough mud in our lower garden to keep an army of kids happy for days.

[toesonthenose]

It's not just rats, sheep and cattle also carry leptospirosis, and any body of water which carries their urine is a potential source of infection. The infection itself is usually mild and easily treated by antibiotics, however a small percentage of infections will enter a severe secondary phase, known as Weil's disease or syndrome. The initial mild primary infection is not Weil's disease. Weil's disease is marked by internal bleeding, kidney and liver failure, and meningitis, with a very high mortality rate. We have Leptospirosis in the streams in Hawaii, and while we hike along them, I don't let me kids swim in them.

[Oregonkiwi]

I had never heard of leptospirosis before I read this thread. I'm a kiwi and have never heard it discussed in NZ - so either it's not a big problem or everyone I know is just unaware.
The Ministry of Health only discusses it as an occupational hazard for farm workers -
The major occupational infectious disease affecting New Zealanders is leptospirosis. In addition to domestic and farm animals, wild animals such as possums, pigs, rodents and birds are actual or potential disease-carriers (eg, psittacosis and salmonella from birds, trichinellosis and wild pigs).
and
Zoonoses are diseases caused by organisms that primarily infect an animal host (wild or domestic) but may be transmitted to and infect humans. They include:

* leptospirosis (usually in New Zealand from contact with infected livestock)

http://www.moh.govt.nz/moh.nsf/c7ad5e032528c34c4c2566690076db9b/b807dca46c0da1d1cc256b8000089c1c?OpenDocument

Personally, I'd be more concerned about giardia
http://www.moh.govt.nz/moh.nsf/by+unid/0F8A4BB6AB175F26CC257042000E2FC8?Open

[Simon & Emily]

Can't help on the technical stuff, but just a thought that if they do play in there (and forgive me if I'm telling you to suck eggs here :o ), try to get them not to put their heads in - ie mouth, nose, eyes and ears - as that's where the infections gets in easiest, and to not to drink it direct ...... unthinkable to us 'grown up adults' but if they are anything like my two little angels......

Emily