[andyplumber]

Hi, I'm hoping we can get an answer to this on the forum, I have submitted my PAR form, if this is OK do I need to get registered with the pgdb[trade body] before I can apply for a job? any info on the process for trade occupation [plumber] would be great. thanks!
Andy

[Bergita]

Hi Andyplumber

I know nothing about plumber, but a quick search of the forum gave me 9 links dealing with plumbing in NZ. Here's the biggest one: http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1887&highlight=plumber

If your info is not on there, use the search option, I'm sure you'll find something. Another useful forum to search is probably NZQA.

[bevsere]

Hi, I'm hoping we can get an answer to this on the forum, I have submitted my PAR form, if this is OK do I need to get registered with the pgdb[trade body] before I can apply for a job? any info on the process for trade occupation [plumber] would be great. thanks!
Andy

Blimey Bergita - that is an old thread. Good on yer for finding it. if thats all I have done on this forum about NZ plumbing and registration, then a good post is way overdue !

I may take this in several long and windy posts to make sure its posting up to the site. Sometimes a long post can be lost. Nightmare.

HI ANDY

Myself and my husband have been in NZ since June 2004. He is a plumber/gasfitter and NZ registered. I have been writing to the migrant forums for several years now and the specialist subject is the PGDB , NZ plumbing and registration.

I will try and 'talk' you through the process. Can you let me know via posts to the thread that you have seen the posts. Ask any questions you like. You need to be clear about what you need to do and what will be required of you to work within the trade.

UK PLUMBER/GASFITTER QUALIFICATION ASSESSMENT

To start with . It is a misconception that a plumber - gasfitter or drainlayer should send off for a PAR [pre-assessment result] to NZQA [ New Zealand qualification authority. Yes , I do know that staff at NZIS [ NZ Immigration Service ] will sometimes suggest this, but its not correct. Simple as that.
If you are a qualified plumber or gasfitter from the UK or even a part-qualified plumber or gasfitter then there is only one place that can assess your UK qualifications . That is the PGDB. [ Plumber, Gasfitter and Drainleyer Board of New Zealand.]

You need to send certified copies of your apprenticeship/ C&G certs/ NVQ certs and proof of past 5 years work experience within the trade.

This is the link to the PGDB assessment form. It is in PDF format. Download it.
It is a request to the PGDB to have them assess your UK qualifications under the ANZRA agreement.
Collate all your documents and send them off, together with the completed form and the fee.

http://www.pgdb.co.nz/index.php?sh=04&h2=04&pic=04&screen=04-anzra-applications&sub=04

If you intend to do gas as well as plumb, you need to send two assessments , two fees etc.

The above is simply to have the plumbing board assess your UK quals. It has nothing to do with registration. I'll get onto that later.

You should, in due course, receive a letter back from the PGDB . Hopefully, it will state that your UK qualifications have been assessed and will be accepted part-way towards registration.
This is a successful outcome and will satisfy the NZIS with regard to your trade skill level . NZIS will be looking for a level 4 to satisfy itself that the tradesman applying under the Skilled Migrant Category [ whether for PR or a work visa] meets the standard. A successful assessment from the PGDB is equivalent to a level 4.

You will have noticed the phrase 'partway towards registration'. That is as good as it gets.

....next post.....

[bevsere]

NZ PLUMBER and/or GASFITTER REGISTRATION

In order to be deemed a fully qualified plumber and/or gasfitter - drainlayer in New Zealand you must registered.
There is only one way to become registered, regardless of what UK qualifications you hold or how many decades of work experience within the trade you have.

To become an NZ registered plumber you must sit the trade registration exam which happens once a year in November and pass a practical assessment.
This is the same exam as New Zealand final year apprentices sit. They must first pass their National Vocational certificate & then they are allowed to sit the Registration exam.
Same goes for any overseas plumber/gasfitter.
If the PGDB will recognise your UK qualifications and work experience as fully UK qualified, then they will allow you to sit the registration exam.

If the PGDB feel your UK quals and work experience are not enough , then they will state that you have to undergo further NZ training to gain the National Certificate BEFORE you can sit the Registration exams.

Are you still following me ?

The PGDB are responsible for the Registration exams. They set them and mark them. It has nothing to do with NZQA.

Be aware that a pass in the registration exams does NOT allow you to be self-employed or to sub-contract or anything remotely like that.
It means you are recognised as a fully qualified plumber who can work as an employee in the trade.

onto next post.....

[bevsere]

LICENCES ALLOWING YOU TO WORK ONCE YOU HAVE THE OFFER OF A JOB

If you look at the PGDB website http://www.pgdb.co.nz/index.php?sh=04&h2=04&pic=04&screen=04-fees&sub=04

you will see an assortment of licenses.

There is only one licence that you can apply for and you can only apply for that once you have an NZ employer willing to offer you a job.
That is the LIMITED LICENCE.
It is the licence that is issued to anyone working within the plumbing trade. An apprentice or a labourer would have one of these.

Both yourself and your Nz employer would apply for the locence wehich would allow you to legally work within the trade in NZ.
You would complete the form and the employer needs to countersign this and vouch for your work by nominating a craftsman plumber to oversee all your work. In theory all your work must be directly supervised. In any case, all your work must be signed off by the person named on your Limited Licence.
You will remain on the Limited Licence until you have passed your Registration exam and sat your practical assessment.

You may need to explain to any prospective NZ employer that you are a fully qualified UK plumber but that it is a PGDB requirement that you sit the NZ registration exam and that until that time you must remain on the Limited Licence.
There is a shortage of plumbers here so many employers will be happy with this. They will also pay you that bit less. LOL

[bevsere]

SUMMARY.

1] Have your UK quals assessed by the PGDB
1a] if intending to submit an EOI to NZIS and you have enough points without a job offer - submit using the PGDB assessment letter to gain points for skill.

2] Gain an NZ plumbing job offer - the best way is by coming to NZ on a job hunt

3] Apply for the Limited Licence
3a] Submit EOI or work visa pllication here to use points for both skill and job offer

4] Start work

5] Sit registration exam and assessment to gain NZ registration

[bevsere]

If you do have thoughts to become self-employed, there are a further two exams that have to be passed.
One is a business exam. you can sit that the year following Registration.
The second exam is the craftsman exam. You cannot sit that until you have two years as a registered plumber.

All of these come with fees and study.

[bevsere]

If you look here

http://www.pgdb.co.nz/index.php?sh=08&h2=08&pic=02&screen=01-past_papers&sub=08

you will see that you can download the past two years exam papers.
This is a brand new facility and very welcome it is to.

Download the plumbers registration question and answers papers. Also the prescrption.

I do have further exam question examples. PM me if you are interested.

I have also compiled a bit of a reading list which I will let you have , if you PM me.
You will find that NZ like their rules , regs and standards. You will need to know them as well as limbering up your math.

There are some very fundemental differences between NZ plumbing and UK plumbing.

If you hope to pass the registration paper , then you will need to be au fait with the NZ working practices. Of course, the best way to gain that is by actually doing the physical work.

I think thats enough for now , don't you ?

Get back to me, so i know that you are clear about the process and what will be required of you.

Plumbers of the world unite.... for our whole world is in boss white

[Ashby]

The PGDB does not list USA as have recognized qualifications. They also do not return emails.
Is the process for an American plumber the same as British?

Again, what is the point to only accepting level 4 skilled and experienced plumbers and then demoting them to apprentice? Making them work for
2+years to re-gain qualifications in NZ?

[victoria]

The pgdb do not answer emails nor can you get past their reception either by phone or in person.If the building had a chimney,we'd have tried abseiling down it to get in. You are completely at their mercy & timescale.You will have to send their application form for assessment to be told that you will be starting at a base level(pay for it) then you will return an application for limited license(pay for it) & wait. I'm told all these (once accepted by the way) are sent to Christchurch for issuing.You might guess by my undertones that I'm not overly impressed by them BUT as a plumber wanting to work in NZ they are the only governing body & you must go through them. One very good thing is you don't need to have NZQA.
I think that's it.
Bevsere is excellent for this info.

[bevsere]

Hi guys.
Sorry, its been ages since I logged onto this site. I've now replied to all the PMs waiting for me.

The whole wide world and the punyverse are not impressed with the service rendered by the PGDB to overseas would-be migrants. LOL

Ashby :-

The process for American plumbers will be the same as for British.

The countries listed on the site are seen as having a comparable standard to the ANZRA plumbing standards.

I would hazard a guess that the only way you will find out if the PGDB will part-way recognise your US quals towards NZ registration would be to fork out the $400 bucks for the assessment. Nightmare , I agree.

There is another way to see if your US plumbing quals would meet the NZIS requirements for a level 4 and that is to use the NZQA pre-assessment application which costs $75.

http://www.nzqa.govt.nz/for-international/index.html

If it comes back at level 4, then you can use this for your NZIS skilled migrant application.

Word of caution though, you will still need to be assessed by the PGDB before you can be certain you will be allowed NZ registration once you have sat the PGDB exam.
If they will not accept your qualification as comparable , they could require you to undergo further training to also gain the National Certificate.

NZIS do not demote overseas plumbers to that of apprentices. They simply need to see that your skill is that of a suitably qualified plumber so you can meet the needs of the NZ employer within the trade.

They know you can legally work in plumbing under the PGDB limited licence but it is up to the mogrant whether they progress to take registration or craftsman exams --or not.

The level 4 is to determine that the person wanting to come in under skilled migrant category has a level of expertise. Its not the same issue as for the PGDB . That is a health and safety issue under ANZRA agreement.
NZIS accept the PGDB assessments because it is the regulatory board. It would also accept a level 4 NZQA assessment for skilled migrant purposes.

[bevsere]

I should also add that it could be helpful to do an NZQA pre-assessment which costs $75 bucks.

If this comes back at level 3 - then it should [ stress the word should] be OK for claiming 50 points as a basic trade qualification.
If it comes back at level 4 , then you are able to claim the bonus points.

If one gets a NZQA level 3 , then odds are that the PGDB will assess the overseas qualification as fine but needing further NZ training once here to gain the National Certificate before sitting the PGDB registration exams.

If its a level 4 - then the PGDB should assess that the quals are recognised to a degree and registration will be given once the PGDB registration exam is passed.

It may be worth the $75 bucks to give some insight as to the way the PGDB may go.

[Ashby]

It seems they have amended things as of July 4 that went into effect on July 30. Now the long term skills shortage list requirements for a plumber are "New Zealand Plumbing registration"
I guess this means that no immigrants will be able to claim 50 points for their plumbing skills (no matter their level in their country of origin)???
Maybe if you have a work visa and a NZ job, you can gain registration before applying but this seems to kill our ability to apply this way from overseas.

[bevsere]

I saw that and it's a nonsense. No plumber can gain NZ registration without sitting the PGDB NZ registration exams.
The best an overseas plumber can do is uplift a PGDB limited licence if they have an NZ job offer.

I am going to try and take this up with NZIS to see exactly what is meant by this impossible criteria.

Also need to look at the PGDB website to see if there have been changes to the way registration takes place.

I wonder if by NZ registration they mean that the overseas plumbing quals MUST go through the PGDB assessment process !

[bevsere]

Maybe if you have a work visa and a NZ job, you can gain registration before applying but this seems to kill our ability to apply this way from overseas.

Weird thing is - you can't. Registration in the plumbing trade is an examination process. The exams are twice a year . I think NZIS have their wording wrong. It's very misleading.

The only thing an overseas plumber can do, is the same as any other skilled migrant. Have the overseas quals assessed and submit that assessment to NZIS.

If there is a job offer involved, the only thing the skilled overseas migrant can do is make sure they have uplifted the necessary licences and checks to belong to their professions or trades regulatory board.

[Ashby]

Registration in the plumbing trade is an examination process. The exams are twice a year .

Can we find a job,get a temp visa, move there, wait and take the exam and then submit the EOI?

I don't see any other alternative!!!!

[bevsere]

Can we find a job,get a temp visa, move there, wait and take the exam and then submit the EOI?

I don't see any other alternative!!!!

1 - Find a job . Get a Temp Visa. Move to NZ. Submit EOI . Get PR and take exam whenever you blooming well like !

2 - Come on visitors visa - find job - get temp permit - submit EOI - gain PR and take blasted exam whenever you like.

for both all you need is a PGDB limited licence.

do it !

I cannot see NZIS turning you down.

[Ashby]

What an absolutely terrifying way to move overseas!!
But, it seems we will have no choice!

After having discussed this with my very wonderful husband, we have decided that when it is "time" (i.e. March), we will pack up everything ready to ship, I will take the kids and dog to my mother's house and he will fly to NZ and find a job/house.

Hopefully, getting a visa will be simple at that point.

And I will push "go" and ship our stuff, send the dog, and bring the kids out.

(he is such a great guy, he offered to fly back to help me get the kids our there! But, they will be easy enough to transport with Benedryl! :nice1 )

Not the ideal way to emigrate around the world but it will work.

[victoria]

Remember you're not alone.Apart from the jolly band of formites, there is Bevsere to guide you on OH's trade. Good on you for committing to the big step. Keep us posted & share with us ... it really helps.

[bevsere]

Sounds like a plan . Way to go <thumbs up smilie>

My bloke came out two months before me whilst I stayed to sell the house etc. Mind you no kids to contend with.

[bevsere]

bumping this thread up for Ashby........

I have sent an enquiry to NZIS to challenge the latest criteria. The enquiry form states that they will reply within 3 working days.


I simply cannot see how any overseas plumber, not yet in Nz, can gain a full NZ PGDB registration.

This requires sitting a 3 hour exam here in NZ and gaining a pass of 60%. The exam is no wal-over. One needs knowledge of the NZ building code, rules, regs and , of course, some knowledge of NZ plumbing. It also requires basic trigonometry math skills .

It also requires that PGDB assess the overseas quals and deems them comparable to the NZ National Certificate.
If it doesn't think this, then it requires gaining the NZ National Certificate as well as a pass in the PGDB exam before there is any possibility of NZ plumbing registration.

[CjChris]

Bevsere: I'm not a plumber nor do I understand half of what NZIS writes up in their rules, but I've read through this thread and wanted to say thank you for contributing so much time and energy to helping others! :clap

:nice1
Christine

[victoria]

Here here !!!

[bevsere]

Bevsere: I'm not a plumber nor do I understand half of what NZIS writes up in their rules, but I've read through this thread and wanted to say thank you for contributing so much time and energy to helping others! :clap

:nice1
Christine

Thanks for the thanks CjChris and Victoria. Karma reputation points your way. :D

Next post = the reading list. :eek:

[bevsere]

OK all you plumbers out there -- and Ashby :D [see I've found the smilie panel now :nice1 ]

There are several publications which you need to know something about in order to pass the exams. I'll try and put in the links and/or contact details.
READING LIST

The Building Code. (http://www.dbh.govt.nz/building-code-compliance-documents)
Scroll down to near the bottom of the page.
The ones you most want are G12 water supplies and G13 foul water.
You can download and print off for free.

-----------

NZ Standards 3500 again - the ones you want most are
Part 2 Sanitary plumbing and drainage
Part 5 Plumbing and drainage - Domestic installations.

NZ STANDARDS (http://www.standards.co.nz/web-shop/?action=basicShopSearch&mod=search&SearchBox1_txtShopName=3500&selStatus=Select%20a%20Status&catalog=NZ)

These will have to be purchased but can then be downloaded as PDF files and printed off. Beware - they are rather large.

---------------

Plumbers, Gas Fitters and Drain layers Act 1976 -

A copy of the Plumbers, Gasfitters, and Drainlayers Act 1976
The most current update is $9.90 but this is subject
to change when the new update comes out.

contact via email.I have added the Brookers link in case the contact is no longer there.
I think you have to register in order to be able to obtain a copy of this Act. You will certainly need be asked questions about it in the exam

Anne Honeyfield
anne.honeyfield@thomson.com
Customer Care Co-Ordinator ,BROOKERS LIMITED (http://www.brookers.co.nz/),
FAX: 64 04 499 8173
Level 1 ,Guardian Trust House ,15 Willeston Street
P O Box 43 .Wellington

--------------------

The Ken Doyle Books . This gives some insight into NZ plumbing.

Two books were at NZD $50 each. Not sure what the price would be currently.
They are owned by The Plumbing ITO (http://www.ito.co.nz/) . I suggest you contact Sue McGarry
sue@ito.co.nz

Very useful books. Most all NZ plumbers and apprentices seem to own copies of these.

------------

... and of course you can download copies of past PGDB (http://www.pgdb.co.nz/index.php?sh=08&h2=08&pic=02&screen=01-past_papers&sub=08)exam papers - questions and answers. This is now a free service.


Happy reading. :rolleyes:

edited --- dunno why some of the links are grey and not blue. Ah well.

[Ashby]

First, let me also say that bevsere and victoria have been saintly in their help
Thank you!

We had wanted to send in our EOI and then the registration thing happened! So, then we decided that we would try to get a job offer and then move over with a work visa. BUT, it turns out that you must have registration with the PGDB to get a work visa. Here we go again!

So, we decided that the only thing to do was to see if we could get OH's quals assessed by PGDB and have him fly over and take the test in November-NZ plumbing sight unseen!!(yes, he is a brave and confident man!!:clap )

I have been bugging NZIS and PGDB trying to get an answer.
WELL, NZIS sent me a link to a page on their website--not at all helpful.
And PGDB sent me an awful mess. I will post these emails next.

[Ashby]

The question was basically how is it possible for a plumber to emigrate under SKilled Migrant with the requirement of registration with PGDB--when that is basically impossible.

The first response:

Dear Dawn


Please refer to the following link for further information.
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/general/generalinformation/news/julyreleaseqas.htm

Thank you for taking advantage of our Online Help facility.

Kind Regards,


James
Customer Service Officer
Department of Labour

Not helpful!! When I sent back the following reply:
I have already read the information from the link you sent and it does not answer my question. My question is about the Skilled Migrant Category--plumber. With the 30 July changes, my husband is unable to apply to emigrate. He is a plumber at the highest level in the US and is willing to start over in NZ. Your new rules will not allow us to have points for his qualifications until he is "registered" with the NZ PGDB--which he can not do until he is employed and has taken an exam. Additionally, the work visa also requires registration with the PGDB before it is valid. How can he meet this requirement when the PGDB will only allow registration AFTER he is in NZ working and taking an exam? It is like a chicken and egg situation. Please help.

NZIS replied:


Dear Dawn

Thank you for taking advantage of our Online Help facility.

You may want to consider applying as an exception to policy for a Work Visa to come into New Zealand with a job offer (maybe as a trainee) and then apply for registration and residency after sitting the exam.

If you feel that you are in an exceptional situation that warrants an exception to policy to be made, you may attach a written request for an exception to your application, providing an explanation and evidence of your situation, and submit this to your nearest office for consideration. I am unable to guarantee an outcome of that request at this time. Your immigration officer will review the merits of your case.



Kind Regards,


Clare
Customer Service Officer
Department of Labour

[Ashby]

I wrote to PGDB to find out if my husband could, in fact, sign up for the Nov. exam. Here is my question:

Ms. Kinealy,
I was hoping you could help me by answering a question. Can my husband take the registration exam if we currently live in the US ?
I am in the process of gathering his information to be assessed by you (PGDB). I will be submitting it by mail early next week. He has been a plumber (and gasfitter and drainlayer) for 15 years in the US --and has achieved the highest level here and owns a successful business. We understand that he will be starting over there and he is happy to learn the NZ way of plumbing.
The 30 July change to the Skilled Migrant Category makes registration with PGDB a requirement before we can emigrate. I understand that he must pass this examination in November to become registered. Will he be able to take this examination? We will gladly fly over for the test. We are willing to do whatever is necessary to move to NZ.
Also, he asked me to find out which code NZ uses--to make sure he is able to study the correct material for your exam.
Thank you very much for your help.
Sincerely,
Dawn

(I feel like I have said the same things over and over and over. :uhoh )

And the response from PGDB (the first one EVER!!!)


Dawn,
Thank you for your email in regards to overseas qualifications and the New Zealand Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board (“the Board”) examinations.
Unfortunately qualifications from the United States are not currently recognised under the Australian New Zealand Reciprocity Agreement (ANZRA). I suggest that you have a look at the following link http://www.pgdb.co.nz/index.php?sh=04&h2=04&pic=04&screen=04-overseas-applicants&sub=04 , which explains which countries have qualifications recognised by the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board (PGDB).
Limited Certificates
You are able to work in New Zealand as a plumber by applying for a limited certificate and working for a Registered Craftsman Plumber under their supervision or direction. The application form is available from http://www.pgdb.co.nz/download/forms/limited_cert.pdf.
Section 38 of the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Act 1976 makes provision for a non-registered person to work in New Zealand as a plumber and/or gasfitter as the holder of a Limited Certificate working under the supervision of a registered or craftsman plumber and/or gasfitter. I enclose an application form for a Limited Certificate and the Board’s publication “Obligations of Registered and Non-registered Persons”. If you wish to obtain a Limited Certificate you will be required to have it signed by the registered or craftsman plumber and/or gasfitter who will be supervising your work.
Further if a limited certificate is held for a continuous period of 5 years the holder of that limited certificate would be eligible for registration as a plumber and/or gasfitter once they achieved:
· a pass in the Board’s written registration examination 9192 for plumbing, and
· be shown to be competent at plumbing and/or gasfitting through a practical test of workmanship undertaken through an accredited training provider.
National Certificate in Plumbing and Gasfitting
The National Certificate in Plumbing and Gasfitting is recognised by the Board as meeting the minimum requirements for the practical test of workmanship. Persons with the National Certificate would then be eligible for registration as a plumber and/or gasfitter once they achieved:
· a pass in the Board’s written registration examination 9192 for plumbing and/or 9193 for gasfitting.
Recognised Current Competency
Skills that have been obtained in plumbing and gasfitting overseas can be assessed within the National Certificate framework for recognition by assessment of Recognised Current Competency (RCC) which acknowledges the skills and knowledge gained from work experience, or from courses or study undertaken. This process may provide credits towards the National Certificate in Plumbing and Gasfitting and therefore shorten the time required to obtain the qualification.
Information regarding the National Certificate in Plumbing and Gasfitting can be obtained from:
Plumbing, Gasfitting and Drainlaying Industry Training Organisation
Level 8, 142 Lambton Quay, Wellington
PO Box 9951
Wellington
New Zealand.
http://www.ito.co.nz
Unitec New Zealand
Carrington Rd, Mt Albert
Private Bag 92025
Auckland Mail Centre
Auckland 1142
New Zealand
http://www.unitec.ac.nz
I trust this information is helpful, should you have any further questions please contact the Board’s Licensing Manager Kern Uren on kern@pgdb.co.nz .
Regards
Melissa Kinealy
Education & Communications Officer
Plumbers Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board

Uhhhh--not exactly the info I was looking for so I tried again....
Hi Melissa,
I don't think I worded my question very well so let me try again...
If we send his qualifications to the Board for assessment, and assuming they are assessed favorably (i.e. giving him credit toward the National Certificate), would he be allowed to sit the exam in November even though we do not live there nor does he have a job yet (or even hold a limited license because of the job situation)?
I am just trying to find out if there is a way to gain registration at all for US plumbers. If not, we are really wasting our time (and money) pursuing this dream of moving to NZ.
We are trying to find out if we even have a chance at all of emigrating!
Thanks
Dawn

And the reply... (SHOCKER--2 emails from PGDB--but you can tell she doesn't really want to deal with me--she keeps referring me to Kern Uren--who does NOT return emails BTW)

Hi Dawn,
Thank you for your email.
I have spoken with my manager who does the overseas assessments. The Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board (“the Board”) does not assess qualifications from countries that are not covered by the ANZRA agreement, the United States is one of these.
My manager recommends you contact Hollie Gunther at the Industry Training Organisation (ITO) and get your husbands qualifications looked in terms of Recognition of Current Competency (see my email below for further details of this path). Hollies contact number is 0064 4471 8426 and her email is hollie.gunther@ito.co.nz.
Once your husband has gained the National Certificate he would then make application to the Board to sit the registration examinations.
I hope this has been of further assistance & please refer to the Licensing Manager, Kern Uren if further information is required (kern@pgdb.co.nz).
Regards,
Melissa Kinealy
Education & Communications Officer
Plumbers Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board


So, I have sent one to Holly and I am waiting for a return email.

We are not encouraged. It is apparent that either NZ in general ---or PGDB in specific, does not really want plumbers--or, at least, American plumbers.
I have gotten very cold to the idea of immigration very quickly.
Australia has a very simple (in comparison) process for assessment--and the requirements to be viewed as "skilled" are much more direct and logical. We are discussing going to Australia--either permanently or because of the Reciprocity agreement with NZ. After becoming a licensed Aussie plumber, then my understanding is that it is a simple process to convert to NZ license.

Or, perhaps, we will just stay here after all. It is ironic, we want to leave here because we have too much. And we are begging to go somewhere where we will have significantly less. But, if NZ doesn't want us, they don't want us. C'est la vie.

[bevsere]

First I want to say VERY WELL DONE for getting the responses you have from the PGDB. I am mightily impressed and on the strength of that alone , I wish you would come to NZ and fight the good fight alongside me.:yes

The PGDB is unhelpful to ALL overseas plumbers no matter what their nationalities are. What you have received by way of communication is astonishing. Just have to discipher it now and then form a plan.

The NZIS response is staggering. Do they really think that qualified overseas plumbers will want to become trainees again ? That's a nonsense. Let's see what NZIS says to me about the self same query.

New Zealand does want you Ashby. The trade and the country would welcome you with friendly open arms. Plumbers are really needed here.

I'm printing off the responses so me and husband and a few other migrant plumbers can read them and have a bit of a collective think.

[victoria]

Oh here's my 2 cents again!

[victoria]

Here's my 2 cents again. NZIS & PGDB are 2 separate animals. Believe me Ashby, the employers here want you very much but they are not au fait with the mechanisations of NZIS. The PGDB is aussie background & work this one out. A kiwi registered plumber would not be recognised in Oz but an aussie one can walk right into NZ.It does seem that you cannot do anything by remote though. We just applied for a temporary license so OH could work right away this was after him getting an assessment (paid for it) from PGDB.Your OH will be able to work under a temporary license or as they're called here a limited certificate.Your OH will have to physically be here to sit the exams.That's what we were told. But very well done for getting the responses you did. I reckon they must be reading the forum!

[bevsere]

Well let's hope they are reading the forum.Maybe one of 'em will understand the paradox that has been created. That's if they are bovvered, of course.

As you say, NZIS and PGDB are very different animals. Part of the same government though and you would think they would at least talk to each other.

Q ? Does the Dept of Labour understand that the absolute plumbing shortage could be stalled as no overseas plumber can apply for PR or a work permit/visa as no overseas plumber will be able to gain the PGDB registration in advance of living and working here, so logically -
no work permit can be issued -as no PGDB registration can be gained -
and no PR can be granted - as no PGDB registration can be gained.

work that one out.

[bevsere]

An overseas plumber can gain a PGDB limited licence IF he has an NZ job offer. That's it !

Are NZIS really stating that , alone of all the trades and absolute shortage skills, a plumber MUST have a job offer before being allowed to submit an EOI, even though that plumber may have well in excess of 100 points? Because as it stands that is the only way a plumber could show any form of "registration" with the PGDB. By having a limited licence which is NOT registration.

A limited licence cannot be issued without a job offer.
Registration cannot be gained without sitting and passing a three hour exam here in NZ. The exam takes study and knowledge of NZ working practices. It's best to have been here for a while.

Are NZIS and PGDB in conflict then? PGDB don't want people to just have a stab at it , yet that would be the only thing an overseas plumber could try if they had a positive PGDB/NZQA assessment. Fly to NZ and sit the exam .

That then makes a mockery of the Health and Safety reasons for these registration exams and the rigorous assessments, exams etc that perfectly good fully qualified overseas plumbers have to go through. Remember some of these overseas plumbers have been in their trade for decades and ran or are running their own businesses. Yet, they face two 3 hour exams and one business exam .

As I said . A paradox .

[Mildred]

Despite having a letter from PGDB saying my husband's Full City and Guilds in Gas Fitting is a suitable qualification to sit their exam, in the NZIZ ITA pack, they have enclosed a yellow form stating full NZQA must be attached, and he needs NZQA Level 4.

Reading the previous posts, we are now confused, especially on NZIS site of trade qualifications it classes City and Guilds as Level 3?

In the 70's when he sat his Full City and Guilds in Gasfitting, you couldn't do so unless it was part of your apprenticeship. Does he still need to get proof of his apprenticeship from his employer?

[Mildred]

Should have written that his qualifications are in fact City and Guilds Intermediate in Gas Fitting and Final Certificate in Gas Fitting.

[Mildred]

Sent e-mail to a case officer and got the following reply:-

At the time your application was sent to you, in order to lodge your application you were required to obtain an NZQA. However, since this time, policy has slightly changed and you now longer require the NZQA Assessment in order to lodge your application with us. Therefore, you do not require the NZQA, but we do need the original letter from the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board advising that your qualifications meet the Board's prerequisite for eligibility to sit the Board's registration exam.

We do not need evidence of your apprenticeship.

[bevsere]

You never did need an NZQA assessment . Someone at NZIS must have enclosed that in error.
Certain UK trades don't require prior assessment . Gasfitting and plumbing is one of them. As long as you know that the UK quals will match to NZIS requirements , then it's OK not to be assessed.

However, you cannot totally escape assessment. They do require that the PGDB assess your quals and will authorise you to be eligible to sit their NZ reg. exams.
This is what I have been in communication about for the past couple of weeks. They did seem to change the policy but that was about the requirement to have NZ registration up front which is impossible.


Anyway
The quote is not the entire list.



Trade Qualifications
The City and Guilds Part One and Part Two Certificates named below, together with evidence of a completed apprenticeship registered with a recognised industry body, are assessed as occupying Level 3 of the Register and will therefore qualify for 50 points.

Note: Visa and immigration officers must ensure that the Part Two Certificate is a full qualification (usually three components). Individual components of the Part Two qualification may be separately certificated. Most full Part Two certificates require completion of three components. Other Trade qualifications not listed below require assessment by the NZQA.

.........................
* Fabrication and Welding Engineering Craft Studies
* Furniture Craft Studies
* Gas fitting
* Hairdressing
* Heating, Ventilation and Air Conditioning
* Instrument Fitting
* Machine Woodworking
* Masonry
* Mechanical Engineering Craft Studies
* Mechanical Engineering Maintenance
* Motor Vehicle Craft Studies
* Motor Vehicle Craft Studies (Light Vehicles, Heavy Vehicles, Vehicle Electricians, Fuel Injection Equipment Mechanics)
* Painting and Decorating
* Plumbing................

All the NZIS need is the PGDB letter of authorisation which states you may sit the exams. Of course you also need to send certified copies of his UK quals , his CORGI and proof of work experience.

That should do it.

[bevsere]

ps - The PGDB assessment requires certified copies of quals, proof of training and/or apprenticeship and proof of work experience.

As NZIS require that you have the PGDB assessment , they will take it as read that your quals etc pass muster.

[Mildred]

Bev

We already had the letter from PDGB stating the qualifications met their requirements to sit their exam.

It wasn't until we got our ITA pack that we started to doubt ourselves on this.

We have now had it confirmed that we don't need NZQA assessment so obviously was an oversight on NZIS's part, but it did make us sweat a bit, i.e. more money off us, and not much time to get our ITA off!

[welwynrose]

my husband is a painter & decorator over here but is "self taught" any ideas how he would go about getting registered in NZ

[bevsere]

Bev

We already had the letter from PDGB stating the qualifications met their requirements to sit their exam.

It wasn't until we got our ITA pack that we started to doubt ourselves on this.

We have now had it confirmed that we don't need NZQA assessment so obviously was an oversight on NZIS's part, but it did make us sweat a bit, i.e. more money off us, and not much time to get our ITA off!

I bet it did:eek:
Good luck with the gas exam when you arrive here.

[bevsere]

my husband is a painter & decorator over here but is "self taught" any ideas how he would go about getting registered in NZ

He doesn't need registration to work as a painter and decorator. Only a few professions and trades require registration - plumbing is one of them.

This trade is on the immediate shortage list.

To gain points for the trade skill you would need to have formal trade qualifications = to the NZ National Certificate at Level 4.

If you gain a job offer as an NZ painter and decorator, then you will have to collate anything - anything and everything which will prove to NZIS that your husband has the skills to match the job. Normally this is done via trade qualifications and work experience.

[welwynrose]

He doesn't need registration to work as a painter and decorator. Only a few professions and trades require registration - plumbing is one of them.

This trade is on the immediate shortage list.

To gain points for the trade skill you would need to have formal trade qualifications = to the NZ National Certificate at Level 4.

If you gain a job offer as an NZ painter and decorator, then you will have to collate anything - anything and everything which will prove to NZIS that your husband has the skills to match the job. Normally this is done via trade qualifications and work experience.


that's a blessing - he started doing painting & decorating 10+ years ago as an occasion odd job for friends of his parents & it turned into his full time job - he's got loads of people willing to give him references & he's got quite a lot of before/after photo's of his work - so hopefully he will be ok

[bevsere]

welwynrose

I should add that you may be required to have the skill level assessed by NZQA.


Frances.

As the PGDB have already assessed your husbands gas quals as OK for their registration exams, then this will suffice NZIS for ITA purposes.

Just send in certified copies of his C&G/ACS certificates etc alongside his work experience proof.

[Mildred]

NZIS did admit to us that they had incorrectly asked for the quals to be assessed, and it our ITA is safely in NZIS's hands!