HELP!!! We want to live in New Zealand......

Dave G

After looking at the points system Iwas slightly confused regarding basic trade qualifications.

I have passed 9 Microsoft Certified Professional (MCP) exams giving me Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer (MCSE) NT4 and just 2 exams away from MCSE Windows 2000.

Also, I have over 4 years experience as a Computer Support Analys/Systems Analyst ranging from building desktop computers to servers for a BIG bank.

But where does it say that this is enough for my family and I to qualify?

The OSL states that there are shortages everywhere but "must have completed a recognised programme of formal training in that area".

My study has been through books and through my work - does this count?

Can someone please guide me in the right direction?

Even better, would someone like to make an offer of employment?

Many thanks for looking and I look forward to your comments.

Dave Confused

andy · Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2004 1:40 pm Post subject:

I assume that what you have is not on the reconised qualifications list. You need to get it all looked at by the NZQA and they will determine what you have the NZ equivalant of.

Nige · Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2004 1:44 pm Post subject:

Hi Dave

I am in a similar position to you. I am an MCSE in Windows 2000. I leave in 5 days for NZ and I will be applying for work under the OSL.

It is my intention to go and obtain a job offer and take that to the immigration office and hopefully be given a work visa on the spot. (Fingers Crossed)

After I have secured my visa my wife and daughter will follow. Not sure if this is the best way but at the moment it is our chosen method.

From information gathered from various companies in NZ they want to know where you done your training. Just be careful not to allow your MCSE to look like a paper qualification. Although you have worked very hard to get it, I am sure you will also know other people who have not and are destroying the reputation of the MCSE.

I think you will find it very hard to get an offer of employment without being in NZ. People want to know how committed you are before they offer. I am sure if you were an employer you wouldn’t employ someone you have not met in person.

I am not sure about the formal qualification. But it does mention a minimum of 3 years work experience and depending on what level you are within your company. i.e Manager etc... (level of responsibility)

I hope i have helped in some sort of weird way. lol Nice One

Dave G · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:41 am Post subject:

Cheers for the replies guys, Nige, I think maybe your route maybe the best.

We've even thought of selling up and going there on holiday and extending our stay to look for employment. Then maybe try and get in the same way.

I have no doubt about my work or experience it's just taking that step.

Then there's the degree option - if I have a couple of years spare. By then the rulez could change again!!!

If anyone else has anymore suggestions - gratefully appreciated.

Taffy · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:49 am Post subject: MSCE

Last time i checked, Microsoft cert'd qualifications didn't count for much, and could not be taken as points within the scheme. I was looking down the same line (although i'm not msce, i do have computer related qualifications), but after discussing this with an agent, I've had to start a degree course. If you have the time to spare, getting a degree will not only help you get a foot in the door, but will also make you more attractive to employers.

I'm only 1/2 way through my first year, so I have another 2 1/2 years before I can even apply! Its very frustrating, but at least when the time comes, I would hope to have a good footing as far as securing a job and a good future for my family.

Things we have to do for a new life!

All the best
Taffy

Nige · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:11 am Post subject:

This is an example of how information provided by immigration can be very confusing.

MCP & MCSE is on the list of qualifications required for the OSL, so really should be accepted. My wife and i went for a meeting with Four Corners Immigration and they informed us that Microsoft, CISCO & UNIX are really the main qualifications they want from applicants. No degree required as your previous experience and responsibilities are considered.

I have cut and pasted this from the immigration website:

Applicants for visas or permits under the OSL are required to have a minimum of 3 years full-time work experience, at least one of the skills identified in the link below, AND have completed a recognised programme of formal training in that area. The current list is effective from 15 December 2003.

When it says formal training it does not state a degree or qualification. It says training. Well I have attended many Official Microsoft Training courses so does that count? Eeeerm…… Who knows???

We also found a section on the immigration website stating that only degrees from certain universities are recognised and I was surprised to see many well established universities not on that list, so make sure you check before you dedicate 3 years of your life.

Marius · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 9:22 pm Post subject:

I' m in the same situation (MCP, MCSA, MCSE with > 6 years experience in IT - but no IT degree).
So Nige, if I will get an IT job offer (go to NZ first).... can I apply on OSL for a work visa even I don't have IT degree??? What about aplying for PR (can I apply with an IT job offer but no degree)?
That's what I understood from Four Corners Immigration paragraph. fingers crossed

"meeting with Four Corners Immigration and they informed us that Microsoft, CISCO & UNIX are really the main qualifications they want from applicants. No degree required as your previous experience and responsibilities are considered. "

I look forward to your comments.
All the best
Marius

Nige · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 10:22 pm Post subject:

I cannot find anything that says you have to have a Degree for jobs on the OSL. If you can then please let me know where. All I have found is a section saying you must have completed formal training.

I will be calling immigration today to ask, so I will let you know what has been said.

I still get the feeling that people feel they are inadequate unless they have a degree. I do not believe this so. An employer is not going to employ you just because you have a degree. They are looking for skilled people who have experience on doing a job, and doing it well. I appreciate the degree will give you an extra 50 points under the expression of Interest but that’s only applicable if you are choosing that method as your port of entry.

I leave in 4 days now and I have many interviews with recruitment companies in Auckland, each one of them knows my situation and they all know I don’t have a degree. They have told me this is not a problem and are arranging interviews with employers for my arrival.

I looked at a site last night, www.nzqa.co.nz the person I believe who runs the site has a degree from Oxford and it is not recognised by the nzqa

Marius · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 11:56 pm Post subject:

Thanks for your feedback.
Looking forward to know what immigration will say.
By the way, did you send your CV to recruitment companies (found on www)?

Thanks
Marius

Nige · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 12:45 am Post subject:

OK I have just spoken to immigration.

The OSL. Taff previously said the Microsoft Certification doesn’t count for much. Well not true. Microsoft is recognised as a proper qualification according to NZ immigration. (And across the world.)

You don’t need a degree to apply for jobs while in NZ on the OSL. But remember you are not applying for residency but a work visa!!!!

It is my intention that after I secure my work visa that then I will apply for residency. Now your points will increase as you have been working in NZ and hopefully gained some qualifications in NZ that will increase the points of your EOI application. Breathe…..

So let’s say I am allowed to work in NZ for 2 years under the work visa. For those of you who have been monitoring NZ immigrations policies for the 12 months, do you really think there will be an EOI then?????? Eeeerm…. NO!!!! I can’t see it; they will change it to something else and the goal posts will be moved also.

If you have been working in NZ for 2 years and you are proving yourself and keeping your nose clean do you really think they will kick you out? Can’t see it. Can you?

I can’t stress enough to people; it is NZ who need you as much as you need them. Don’t be scared to call them and ask questions.

I only know IT so I can’t only answer for that industry.

I emailed my CV to recruitment agencies and then I followed it up with a phone call.

Regards

Nige

Marius · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 1:15 am Post subject:

Thanks for your feedback.
My intention is also to go there...secure a job ....and EOI (if there it will be an EOI when I will apply... I don't think....will see)
I wanted to ask you how you contacted recruitment agencies, but you already asked this question.
By the way, you called NZIS - London or NZ (do you have an international number for NZIS _ NZ)?....
I saw on OSL let's say Auckland (http://www.immigration.govt.nz/NR/rdonlyres/B05131D3-387E-4F7D-976B-BE86FDA6EEA6/0/ITSkillsListOSLDec03.pdf) that "Applicants for visas or permits under the OSL are required to have a minimum of three years full-time work experience in at least one of the skills identified on the shortage list above Razz

AND have completed a recognised programme of formal training in that area.

" The last part of the sentence confused me "have completed a recognised programme (could mean MCP, MCSE ?!??!)of formal training in that area" (I have a Univesity Degree recognised by NZQA but not in IT).

All the best
Marius

Nige · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 5:06 am Post subject:

Hi Marius

I called the London office of immigration. The section text on the OSL of "completed a recognised programme of formal training in that area"

According to immigration this means i must have attended a Microsoft Course and have evidence to prove this. And it must be at a Microsoft Certified Training Centre.

Marius if you have a degree you may be able to get in on that. Call them and ask

Nige

Taffy · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 5:43 am Post subject:

My mistake!
I thought you were talking about PR not just work visas. When I emailed an agency to enquire about MSCE I was told it wouldn't be good enough to secure points on.. That was their opinion, so I'll keep quiet on this one now!

Hope you get the answer you are looking for, there seems to be much confusion in this area!

Taffy

Dave G · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 8:49 am Post subject:

Well look what I've started......

I think overall that the MCSE is industry recognised. If you want the points get a degree, get over there and get a job.

As stated earlier, keep your nose clean and apply for residency.

We're all speculating here so until someone tries for it we won't really know.

The one thing that has confuse everyboby is the "Formal Training". That ones got everyone talking.

When the first few EOI's have been scrutinised that's when they will realise that maybe they haven't quite got it right.

[i]Now where's that open university prospectus........? And if that's not enough I've an active directory exam in a week or so...where does it end? Eek

evelynne_r · I Like It Here Joined: 25 Jan 2004 Posts: 94

Although they say you need to have a recognised qualification in the area for OSL, I'm not sure how strictly they hold to that.

My degree is in French, but I have 8 years' experience in web development/business analysis. I was a bit concerned when I went for my work permit at the NZIS Wellington office, but they looked at my job offer, looked at my CV and stamped the permit into my passport.

Don't know that I'd count on this happening every time though.

Evelynne