Tell NZIS what you think

Jamie Smith · Posted: Fri Jul 16, 2004 9:39 pm Post subject: Tell NZIS what you think

Hi all

Before I go to Aussie I've arranged to meet with some of NZIS' senior peoples, to tell 'em what i think of their blinking policies and say some goodbyes.
Nutcase

I think it would be helpful to all of us if I could pass on direct comments from frustrated applicants to the head of the policy unit and the head of Customised Service.

NZIS know they have some problems with policy, at last, so maybe we can pitch to a receptive ear.

Please either PM me, email me or post a message here, listing what you think about the general issues, costs, time frames, clarity of information, interpretation, case officer vagaries, difficulties anywhere etc.

These two are senior management, so please make comments objective and back up with specifics. Hmmm

LET HER RIP!

I'll print out and hand over to NZIS.

Will let you know about the reception...

Regards

Moorf · Posted: Fri Jul 16, 2004 10:40 pm Post subject:

Thanks Jamie - what is the deadline for our comments?

Moorf

Jamie Smith · Posted: Fri Jul 16, 2004 11:54 pm Post subject:

I fly to Wellington on Thursday 22nd at 2.30, so.....

Any late messages I may try to get the NZIS people on line to show them

Cheers

ruthyroo · I'll Hang Around A Little Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 39

Having just recovered from a traumatic day spent at NZIS in Hamilton, would welcome the chance to off load. No doubt that the experience we had will be reflected by many others, despite different individual cases. My Husband is a secondary teacher, we planned to apply for three year work permits, with him getting his due to the POL list and me getting an open permit as his partner. All our conversations with the NZIS helpine indicated that my permit would be issued along with his, as long as we could demnstrate that we met the partnership requirements. So off we went to NZIS Hamilton, who took our applications, told my husband that they could indeed do his permit on the spot, but mine would be at least a 6 months wait as they were very behind in procesing partnership applications. As I had a job to start on Monday, and all our financial arrangements had been made on the basis that we would both be working, this was a severe blow. What made it worse was that we had never been told about this long processsing time at any point, by anyone, despite spending a flipping fortune on the phone the NZIS. When we pointed this out to the guy on the desk, he replied that 'that's the problem with the Helpline, they don't know the situation in the individual branches so that can't give the right information out'!!!
We explained our situation to the person who processed my husbands application. He explained that they had a backlog of applciations from December 2003!! but he said that if we could wait until the afternoon he would try to get it done. So then followed 4 hours of wandering around Hamilton, worrying ourselves sick that our plans had gone pear shaped. IN the event, he did get it done, but it is ridiculous that something like that should depend on the good will of the person you happen to come across.

To summarise in a more refelctive way the main issues for me were:
1. Lack of consistency in information given out by NZIS London / NZIS Auckland / NZIS branches in NZ. They don't even agree on office opening hours never mind important info like processing times!
2. The whole attitude of NZIS seems to be to put the responsibilty onto the applicant at all times to get the right info (almost impossible - see above) and find their way through the maze. Why can't they instead take the approach that the applicant is a client, who needs NZIS assistance to get to the desired outcome what ever it may be? And help them through the process rather than hindering it.

Sorry this got so long! Best of luck.

Jamie Smith · Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2004 2:14 pm Post subject: Re: My tuppence worth

That one is just perfect Ruthyroo - left hand not knowing about right hand, information not shared with public etc.

keep 'em coming

karltsmith · Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2004 9:04 pm Post subject:

Hi Jamie,

Not just a "thoroughly good egg" but a peoples champion!

I've discussed our personal battle with you personally as you know and have little to add to that, however one thing did spring to mind that suggests that NZIS could potentially lose contact with it's clients.

We entered the EOI pool before coming out on a LTWV to cut through the all the mess and red tape the new system has caused....mainly because no employer is going to keep a job open long enough for NZIS to approve an application!

When we arrived we sent a letter to Wellington to let them know of our change of address, ie our NZ address. They duly replied acknowledging the changes to our NZ address.

When our EOI was selected from the pool our invitation to apply was sent to our old UK address.....which by now of course we had vaccated 3 months earlier.

Were it not for some switched on new owners and neighbours we would never had known it had been sent in error to the UK and we could have sat here waiting...and waiting....

After I was contacted by my Mother from the UK I called the London office and was told that there were in effect two systems/databases...one for the EOI pool and one for invitations and that the latter had not been updated with the new information updated on the former!

One wonders how such a situation could occur, I am assuming that both databases related and autoupdate?

I hope ours was a one off but certainly there is a flaw in the system!

Jamie Smith · Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 12:26 pm Post subject:

Hi all

The meeting with NZIS was more interesting by what was NOT said.

They say success has many fathers while failure is an orphan. Examples = all the extra crew travelling with UK World Cup rugby team (!), and NZIS people mumbling "not my department" to most of the issues raised last week.

I do know that they are considering a rehash of the points mix, but this is just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titianic routine - helping everyone score more is not going to overcome the fear of not having enough points, nor will it overcome the problem of trying to get a job from 12,000 miles away, nor will it give employers confidence that they can start their new migrant "next week".

Also heard a concession that the relationship advisors hired to recruit migrants are not being particularly successful.

The Govt is working on advertising job vacancies online, but this will not only duplicate the existing services such as Seek and Netcheck, but taxpayer funds will be sued to compete with tax paying businesses! And we know any Government is not good at running competitive service businesses.

The job search visa idea is presently being mooted for Pacific Islanders only, perhaps because there is politicial pressure to get Govt to meet the PI quota and Labour do well with PI votes... The main reason given by the Minister for not having job search type visa is the risk of becoming overstayers as people have signalled their desire to stay here by wanting to look for work.

UK people are actually big overstayers too. For heaven's sake, the damage to the economy is greater if we don't get enough workers more than it is harmed by a few overstayers. Not advocating overtaying, but more priority must go to bringing in working bodies.

I did pass on your printed comments and also asked NZIS why they don't monitor and participate in these forums.

Two NZIS officials said that XYZ person was meant to be participating in discussions but I am not aware of their presence at all, and the officials were certainly unaware of what you guys had been saying - someone not doing their job properly and not being supervised properly either.

Business branch also unconcerned at one in 5 chance of being approved for LTBV (4 in 5 if from UK), but they could not adequately explain how someone with no business ownership / management history could be approved as having relevant business management experience while another business owner from another country who was proposing to operate the same business type in NZ could not.

The variances between case officers just makes things too unreliable.

Anyway, no suprises there, just disappointment that it will take public failure and ongoing hardship to well intended migrants before any viable change is introduced.

My suggestion?

Perhaps direct personal contact will help.

Send an email or letter to the Minister Hon Paul Swain

Freepost Parliament,
PO Box 18888, Wellington
pswain@ministers.govt.nz
Fax: (04) 495 8466

While you're at it, send a copy to The Opposition Spokesperson for Immigration,
Dr Wayne Mapp, :
Freepost Parliament,
PO Box 18888, Wellington
wayne.mapp@parliament.govt.nz Fax: (04) 473 0469

And a real agitator about immigration policy,
Hon Winston Peters:
Freepost Parliament,
PO Box 18888, Wellington
Fax: (04) 471 2042

Cheers all

evelynne_r · I Like It Here Joined: 25 Jan 2004 Posts: 94

Thanks Jamie - an interesting post there. Keep us informed if you hear anything more.

Cheers,

Evelynne

nisse · I'll Hang Around A Little Joined: 03 Feb 2004 Posts: 31

Also heard a concession that the relationship advisors hired to recruit migrants are not being particularly successful.

Firstly, thank you Jamie for your account of the meeting with NZIS.

Doesn't seem too surprising to me that these relationship advisors are not too succesful. I for one have never heard of them, have never seen anything about them anywhere, what they do, where they operate etc.

I know, or think I know, that there's supposed to be an immigration recruitment drive on in the UK, but maybe it would serve NZ well to look outside the box, as there are many highly qualified people who speak excellent English in Europe. But if NZ focuses all its attention on the UK only, it will not reach these people.

Regards

Nisse